In a War Which would win?

In a War Which would win?

  • Union of Border Worlds

    Votes: 14 42.4%

  • Free Republic of Landreich

    Votes: 14 42.4%

  • A Draw

    Votes: 5 15.2%
  • Total voters
    33
  • Poll closed .
Not that they would capture UBW, but they could probably flank around (assuming Confed/Kilrathi are neutral and allow warships to pass) and cut off their supplies, and win by attrition. Plus, as stated, Landreich was left alone except for occasional raiders, and that one strike by the Kilrathi during BoT, in the war. They've had time to settle in and bunker up so to speak. Not like UBW which practicaly was the front line in the war, meaning their colonies are probably thin, poorly equiped, and hard pressed to get mining up. Not to mention building capacity. As I recall LOAF said in another thread you're looking at 10 years for *Confed* to build a ship yard, another 5 for *Confed* to get that shipyard all ready to mass produce one class of ship. Even in WCP, assuming they have the help of Confed building their yards and giving them workers, they would still be 7 years behind the building game. It would be best to say that unless this was well after WCP, UBW's ship building capacity is limited, at best. And more likely non-existant.
 
While I may agree with your production estimates, since this is (assumedly) around WC:p era-the UBW has had a fair amount of time to reconstruct their system. While they may have been on the front lines, and taken quite a beating-that doesn't mean that in the time from the Kilrathi War to present day, they wouldn't have a good portion of their system up and running.
 
plus the landreich had good repair teams, as is evidenced by their refitting/repairing of the Confed escort carriers and the Karga, while Border World repair facilities are unknown or nonexistent

besides, the landreich could always just leave a frigate in orbit armed with a bioweapon/nuke and launch it when a rescue force arrived and then leave the system (which would be pointless, but it would deny the BW the use of the planet)
 
The use of a bioweapon would instantly bring upon them the wrath of the almighty confed. Making 1 planet useless in trade for a well armed and massive space force declaring war on you is *not* a smart idea. This would have to be a clean fight for Confed to stay out. No dirty tricks like in the war or the likes of which Black Lance did.
 
Originally posted by Quarto
Hmm, but is the Landreich's concentration in one area really a benefit, or a disadvantage?
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Well, the Cats got as far as Hellhole before being beaten back by the Landreich Home Defense "Fleet" weren't they? That's pretty darned good, considering the lack of ships Kruger has and the viciousness of the Kilrathi insurgence.
 
Indeed, LeHah, but my point was that while the Landreich's concentration helps in a defensive war, its probable military advantage would probably push them into an offensive war.

Meanwhile, it is worth noting that the Border Worlds have probably received a lot of Confed aid since '73. This aid, combined with the sheer advantage in resources that they have over the Landreich further complicates any estimates of BW military strength in '81.
 
Which might also mean their fighters/ships are more advanced if they can buy Confed's older craft. As for repair facilities, unknown and non-existent are very differant things. Logically, the more manpower and resources you have, the better you can do that sort of thing.

As for ship building, yes, traditional ship building techniques take a very long time. However, there are other ways of doing it, such as the foundry ships used to build the Vesuvii. That only took, what, 4 or 5 years?

Best, Raptor
 
There's at least one (really long) jump line on LOAF's map that connects Landreich and Border Worlds systems, so you could get from one nation to another without having to cross Confed or Kilrathi space. Trying to fight a war though (with flanking moves and what not) without infringing either Confed or Kilrathi space might be a little tough.

Best, Raptor
 
The fact that they have military officers doesn't mean they have much of a military, IMO -- the fact that the Border Worlds relied on Confed to defend them in Secret Ops should be evidence of this...
 
We must also remeber that the Border Worlds have survived alot of wars and each time they have been able to come back. The border worlds have the istinct to survive so I believe they would win.
 
The Border Worlds didn't 'survive a lot of wars' -- they didn't even *exist* as a nation until 2673. During the Kilrathi War the region that became the BWU was the center of the action -- but it was the Confederation who was throwing men and ships into the fight...

It's the *Landreich* who survived the Kilrathi war on their own -- although the backwater colonies weren't an important Kilrathi target, they did manage to fend off three major Kilrathi invasions and innumerable Kilrathi raids *without* the help of Confed.
 
Couple of Q

1)Can you intercepr another ship inside the *hyperspace*?

2)Is the *Hyperspace* inside the territory or the jurisdiction of the respective nation?
 
Originally posted by Raptor
Which might also mean their fighters/ships are more advanced if they can buy Confed's older craft. As for repair facilities, unknown and non-existent are very differant things. Logically, the more manpower and resources you have, the better you can do that sort of thing.
Click to expand...

Case in point, the Landreich has fighters with corvette engines attached to them. Think of the time and ability it takes to strap a 20-year-old fighter onto a pair of engines made for a much larger ship...

Not to mention, Kurger also seems to be able to skim some kind of ship away from ConFleet (That Destroyer when he defected, The Tarawa for all of a short while before The Battle Of Terra, The former Tarawa during False Colors)
 
Originally posted by LeHah


Case in point, the Landreich has fighters with corvette engines attached to them. Think of the time and ability it takes to strap a 20-year-old fighter onto a pair of engines made for a much larger ship...
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Quite frankly, that doesn't impress me all that much. The Corvette engine is probably a long cylindrical object, and the Ferret (which iirc is what is attached to the engine) has a nice big slot underneath the fighter which would make a nice mounting spot for the fighter. The Ferret is probably just mounted on top of the engines with the lower wings straddling the engine.
In another game universe (Jovian Chronicles), one of the nations (the Jovian Confederation) uses a very similar design for one of their fighters (albeit with a smaller, conventional thrust engine). The Lancer fighter is basically a small cockpit and weapons pod mounted on top of a 'plasma blowtorch'.
In short, its just a matter of attaching the right wires and welding the Ferret to the engine.
Personally, I'd rather save the corvette engines for corvettes. Fighters don't have the endurance to properly take advantage of the engines, imho.

By the time of WCP, I would guess that the UBW is flying Thunderbolts and Excaliburs, just like Confed. The fact that Confed is phasing them out means that the UBW can probably get them for fairly cheap. There may also be some Tigersharks and/or UBW exclusive craft for high priority installations.
One other thing to keep in mind is pilot experience. The UBW is located on the border with the Kilrathi, and probably has to deal with raids by Kilrathi pirates. This would give many of the UBW pilots a certain amount of experience with live combat. The Landreich, on the other hand, being in a more isolated position, might not have this edge. While the older veterans might have plenty of combat experience, the newer pilots are probably all still fairly inexperienced.
Equipment-wise, the Landreich would probably have the edge. The UBW would probably have an edge in pilot quality, however.
 
Originally posted by junior


By the time of WCP, I would guess that the UBW is flying Thunderbolts and Excaliburs, just like Confed. The fact that Confed is phasing them out means that the UBW can probably get them for fairly cheap. There may also be some Tigersharks and/or UBW exclusive craft for high priority installations.
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Or...the UBW could just rely on Confed for protection, as it seems they do.....

One other thing to keep in mind is pilot experience. The UBW is located on the border with the Kilrathi, and probably has to deal with raids by Kilrathi pirates. This would give many of the UBW pilots a certain amount of experience with live combat. The Landreich, on the other hand, being in a more isolated position, might not have this edge. While the older veterans might have plenty of combat experience, the newer pilots are probably all still fairly inexperienced.
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The Landreich has some of the most expereinced pilots around! The Landreich also i'm sure has to contend with pirates and all kinds of other stuff. In fact, the Landreich probably has MORE experience than the UBW because Confed does most of their work for them....
 
Originally posted by Raptor
There's at least one (really long) jump line on LOAF's map that connects Landreich and Border Worlds systems, so you could get from one nation to another without having to cross Confed or Kilrathi space. Trying to fight a war though (with flanking moves and what not) without infringing either Confed or Kilrathi space might be a little tough.

Best, Raptor
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thanks thats all i was asking about.
if bwu know of the attack on the only connecting system then they can put enought ships and other for in system to beat back then attack.
 
Originally posted by Ladiesman^


Or...the UBW could just rely on Confed for protection, as it seems they do.....



The Landreich has some of the most expereinced pilots around! The Landreich also i'm sure has to contend with pirates and all kinds of other stuff. In fact, the Landreich probably has MORE experience than the UBW because Confed does most of their work for them....
Click to expand...


UBW has Confed around for the heavy stuff (Nephilim battle fleets, etc...), but the UBW still has its local forces. Otherwise it wouldn't have a 'militia'. And given the fact that the 'Confed Protection' led to at least one near disaster in recent history, I'm fairly confident that the UBW isn't about to turn everything over to Confed.
The UBW militia probably still has a force composition similar to what they had during WCIV, just with modernized forces. They've undoubtedly got newer fighters to replace the Rapiers and what-not that they were fighting the Black Lance with, and the Thunderbolts and Excaliburs are probably their primary heavy fighters. And the Intrepid has probably been replaced, as well, although not by anything as good as the Murphy or Plunkett that Confed uses. A few Eagle-class CVEs might be a possibility, though.

As for the Landreich - they're in the boondocks. Where are they going to find anything to fight? Perhaps the occasional human pirate, but not Kilrathi pirates. The UBW is on the Kilrathi border, and we know from the WCP manual that Kilrathi pirates are still very much of a threat to human interests. As a result, the majority of Kilrathi pirate raids into human space are probably going to be directed at UBW interests, and somebody has to hold down the fort until the navy arrives to clean things up. Confed Navy is in the middle of peace time, and with no real opponents to challenge Confed's strength, the navy is going to be smaller, meaning that the weight of dealing with pirate raids falls on the local garrisons. Those garrisons are going to be militia forces, not Confed Navy. The navy won't arrive until after the raid is over, and someone needs to track the raiders back to their home.
The Landreich no doubt has some excellent pilots, but they're starting to get a little grey hair mixed in with the black (or brown or blond). The UBW may or may not have as many older veterans (its doubtful that Hawk is the ONLY Border Worlder vet still in the cockpit), but I can almost guarantee that the ones that got in the cockpit in the last few years have seen more action than new Landreich pilots have.
 
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