this game, WC Saga, and the truth

[wankski]

It's not a case of entitlement at all. We already talked about it in this thread: for (quite literally) years, Saga followed everything Standoff did with some amazing announcement and the promise that a demo (or a "proloque"?) was almost ready. The point now is that clearly wasn't true -- they were faking results and lying about their release in order not to "lose face" to another mod... and that's idiotic. Under those circumstances, people certainly have a right to ask where Saga is -- because it's the Saga guys who promised it, not some assumption of entitlement on everyone elses part.

ahh, i c... Apparently i've been away for too long. Point taken.

 

[meisdavidp]

He's saying that everyone should question whether or not the news the Saga team gives is a hoax or not.

But the thing is... a lot of us would almost prefer the hoax news at this point. Then we can at least know they're alive and so forth... If they intended to drop the project, it would be nice of them to have the decency to tell us. Otherwise, I guess we keep waiting...

 

[LeHah]

Truthfully, I was just badly coining a line from a bad episode of The Simpsons

But in actuality, I don't care enough about Saga to see them finish or not. This is mostly because of bad experiences I had with some of the people working on it - I don't buy novels from Kevin J Anderson because I do not like his writing, and in the same vein, I will not play Saga because I do not like the people that made it.

I mean, I hope Saga makes me eat crow but short of devine intervention, I don't see this happening for another 5 years, if that.

 

[Bandit LOAF]

I think it's important to separate the machine from the man. It's entirely possible that Saga could come along and be amazing -- that won't make the people good... and the people being bad right now doesn't necessarily make the project bad. Certainly, it's a suggestion either way... but it's entirely possible that

Now, I'll admit, the history isn't good... WCU and the Privateer Remake are both terrible projects by terrible people -- but lets not sell Saga down the river because they've been a jerk about it. Heck, it's entirely possible that they have every right to be jerks about it... maybe it is that good. We'll hopefully see.

 

[Manic]

I don't doubt we will see a finished project here... there's just been way too much work done, for someone to simply give up... That might be wishful thinking, however. All I can say is I hope they capture the feel of Wing Commander, instead of winding up with Freespace+WC models.

 

[LeHah]

...but lets not sell Saga down the river because they've been a jerk about it. Heck, it's entirely possible that they have every right to be jerks about it... maybe it is that good. We'll hopefully see.

I dunno. Being a close knitt bunch of jerks for almost the entire 5 years the project has been around? I can't find the reasoning in that.

 

[meisdavidp]

LeHah, Interesting statement about Mr. Anderson. I enjoyed Dark Apprentice, but that was about it for his writing. I tend to favor Michael J Stackpole. Knowing your oppinion; however, I still wonder why you see any reason to comment here. You hope they make you eat crow but you don't care if they ever finish? Which is it? Everyone is entitled to their own opinion of course.

I don't have any history or knowledge of the history others have with Saga team, so I'm not even going to go there, but I wonder how they feel making a mod for a largely despised engine that would be played by a community that seems to have issues with them. Not saying they didn't create those issues themselves, but still, you gotta wonder why the hell they should even care. I'd love to see this project completed and released. I'd also understand entirely if they pulled the plug as long as they came clean about it. It's the not knowing anything that pisses me off.

 

[LeHah]

LeHah, Interesting statement about Mr. Anderson. I enjoyed Dark Apprentice, but that was about it for his writing. I tend to favor Michael J Stackpole.

A lot of people seem to like Stackpole - but what I've read of his stuff didn't do anything for me. In fact, outside of Zahn, the only two Star Wars writers I like are Steve Perry and Karen Traviss. I'm notoriously picky and close-minded about EU as a whole, though.

You hope they make you eat crow but you don't care if they ever finish? Which is it?

Allow me to correct or clairify myself then.

This is a situation in which I hope I eat crow. I hope I'm proven wrong. I hope Saga develops a stellar game which bolsters more fans to our group and interest in reviving the series over at EA. I hope Saga is a fantastic game that makes me fall in love with Wing Commander all over again for the 80th time.

I don't see this happening though. As a matter of fact, I don't see much of *anything* at this point. After five years, a couple of unfulfilled demo announcements, a bunch of bratty postings, at least one really underhanded attempt to undermine another fan project, bad PR and generally acting like a Derek Smart cloning facility - I'm glad I washed my hands of them when I did.

I'd also understand entirely if they pulled the plug as long as they came clean about it. It's the not knowing anything that pisses me off.

I think thats a fair assumption - for whats an unfair situation. By this point, most of us have seen the dog and pony show that is Wing Commander Saga. A lot of us would be a lot less dour about it of they *were* forthcoming. Instead, they have this "running in circles" logic to them. Much like Duke Nukem Forever - it'll be done when it's done.

 

[meisdavidp]

Haha that's twice this mod has been likened to DNF (did not finish?).

For the record, I prefer Stackpole's non-SW stuff, actually. The Dark Glory War and Talion: Revenant remain among my favorite fantasy books along with certain parts of the Wheel of Time series and Orson Scott Card's "A Planet Called Treason."

As far as all the vaporware comments go, why not nominate it for some of those Funtabulous vaporware awards which would make Saga team look silly and bring possible new attention to the community? And then they can either admit defeat, release something or continue looking silly forevermore.

 

[AD]

As far as all the vaporware comments go, why not nominate it for some of those Funtabulous vaporware awards which would make Saga team look silly and bring possible new attention to the community? And then they can either admit defeat, release something or continue looking silly forevermore.

I don't think that's quite the kind of attention this community either needs or wants.

 

[meisdavidp]

but everyone loves babies because they're weak and helpless, right? people are all like AWWW A BABY and pick them up. See that's what we need.

I can see it now.

us:WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH
EA: WTF? WC INFANTS
us:WWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH
EA: UM?
us:Mama? MAAAAAAAAAMAAAAAA!!!!
EA: awwww so cuuuuute!
EA picks up WC and makes new games and we all grow into furry cats that attempt to extinctify the human race. The End

 

[LeHah]

I don't think that's quite the kind of attention this community either needs or wants.

Not to mention, it's the minority in the community proper. We have two great fanmods finished and we have all this new forthcoming stuff like Prophecy MP. Airing your dirty laundry or letting your deformed, formerly conjoined evil twin out of the basement is never a good idea.

 

[meisdavidp]

yeh... guess I should appologize for my conjoined twin... he's kinda dumb and hyper like...

Btw, which is the second fanmod that's finished? I know Standoff has come amazing distances, but they have never claimed to be finished. Same goes for Gemini Gold... so aside from UE, what's been finished?

 

[Mace]

Standoff works with episode releases I believe, and three of them have been finished.

Dude, why are you pissing people off who do not give you what you want?
They responded, and gave their vision on this case, they have a personal life and jobs like everyone else, and have spend a lot of time on a project they want to give to you and and this community, give, not sell. Why complain?

 

[LeHah]

Dude, why are you pissing people off who do not give you what you want?

Because... they're not giving us what we want?

They responded, and gave their vision on this case, they have a personal life and jobs like everyone else, and have spend a lot of time on a project they want to give to you and and this community, give, not sell. Why complain?

I somehow think that LOAF already stated this but - how did having a life away from a fanmod become some reasonable excuse? Unknown Enemy and Standoff got made by people who have jobs and lives and friends. The whole "woe is me" shit doesn't sell.

 

[Chicken]

Jargon

You just murdered one of my brain cells

The reason why Standoff has been successful and Saga persecuted is because the Standoff team delivered their promise:

We've got Standoff Episodes 1-3.

Saga hasn't released anything... which is pretty much self explanatory.

A person can easily spout words to say how great it is, but when there is no product to back it up, there's gonna be trouble.

 

[meisdavidp]

I wasn't naysaying Standoff, I was simply saying that it's not entirely complete. I haven't played enough to form a decent opinion but now that I have my broadband back I fully intend to.

 

[Lt.Death100]

Believe me Standoff is good and only gets better as it progresses. We have no idea what Saga can do because it hasn't been released yet and probably won't be for a very long time. I have no doubt that Saga could be a great mod I just don't see it getting done soon.

 

[Mace]

Lehah, all i am saying is that when someone wants to do something for a community, they should be supported in their effort. They want to do this, and you want to see it.

I have not seen a rolling demo of Pioneer either, just some concept art.

 

[LeHah]

Lehah, all i am saying is that when someone wants to do something for a community, they should be supported in their effort. They want to do this, and you want to see it.

If you're trying to sell something to someone, you don't come out and tell them they're an asshole. Nor do you go over to the next store and knock over their goods so you can sell more stuff. Saga is guilty of both those inexcusable things.