More Map Progress

[Bandit LOAF]

My dead-tree version of the script says Gardel.

 

[Wedge009]

Enigma Sector
It seems sensible to link Midian, Fiddler's Green and Niffleheim with Piper - however, the closest access to those systems would be through the Sol Sector. I don't think the Kilrathi would slug their way through Sol just to strike at some out of the way colonies. Perhaps a jump line from Nifflehiem to Cabrea? Then it might make more sense when Sparks comments about the marines retaking Niffleheim (in the winning track).

Also, it looks like the 'top-right' corner of the Isaac Quadrant has been thrown out of alignment.

Vega Sector
Overlay problem again, this time on Nephele (Downing Quadrant), Enyo and Cambria (Day Quadrant) systems.

Epsilon Sector
Chanel and Bifrost still have jump lines overlaid when you added Sharm. I recommend adding a jump line which carries on to K'ta Mek (the nearest Kilrathi system), since Paladin went to Sharm to map the vectors of the incoming fleet.

M'shrak Sector
Still has some systems overlaid with jump lines.

I've fixed the above problems - and added the jump lines. They should be in your e-mail (loaf@wcnews.com).

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Enigma Sector, near Gwynedd.

Why is B'Shriss there?

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
I'm thinking of taking all the location-less Confed systems and sticking them in the Facin Sector, to fill it out. Places like Yorin, New Samarkand and so on.

Facin Sector?

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
One jump from Firekka?

Sounds right for Tau Ceti.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Eeek... and they're in-game systems from SM1.5. (Hey, wait, they aren't in Claw Marks...)

Yes they are - on the map near the end. Else I wouldn't be pestering you about them.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Can't find this anywhere in the SO1 script.

Well, I wrote this down for some reason. Possibly where the Rigakh cruiser came from?

So much stuff, and so little time to do it in!

 

[Quarto]

Originally posted by Wedge009
Why is B'Shriss there?

Because the timeline suggests the impossible - that Blair found Iceman while living at Caernarvon . I never liked this ("Yes, let us send a suspected traitor into a Kilrathi system in a jump-capable ship!"), but there seems to be no other way to interpret Iceman's time of death.
Still, placing the B'Shriss system near Gwynedd, and connecting it both to Gwynedd and Racine or K'arakh would actually solve a great problem for us - the question of where did the Concordia come from at the start of WC2. After all, had they been retreating from Ghorah Khar, we would have had to assume that the Rebellion had been crushed.

Yes they are - on the map near the end. Else I wouldn't be pestering you about them.

They ain't there, Wedge. Actually, it's quite possible that these systems aren't even in Vega - they may be codenames for Kilrathi systems in Kilrah Sector.

Well, I wrote this down for some reason. Possibly where the Rigakh cruiser came from?

Wow, I must say it again - well spotted, young Jedi . That's exactly on the money:
"A Rigakh cruiser made it past the defensive forces on the Ghorah Khar-Rarkath border."

Now, about the Enigma sector systems... LOAF, adding those three systems (Midian-Niffleheim) all strung out like that may not be the best idea. The way Angel says it, one would assume that these are three different attacks ("all across the sector"), and not a single offensive (which in this case it would have to be). This would make it more difficult to find places for them, but hey, might as well get them right .

Also, Gardel - I think it makes sense that the system Tolwyn refers to would be linked up with Morpheus, and that would almost have to mean the Cardell system. Why would Cardell/Gardel be on the frontline while Orsini is considered a backwater? The answer is that they were both - until recently - a backwater. Then something happened - the Kilrathi offensive which got as far as Vespus and resulted in the loss of the Concordia. We can assume they came through Morpheus and Cardell. Orsini never got heavily attacked, simply because the Kilrathi were too busy pushing towards Sol Sector. And besides, Orsini's connected to Vega Sector, so it would have soon been swarming with Confed reinforcements. So, once Cardell/Gardel is retaken, Orsini becomes nothing more than a backwater - and so does Gardel, now that we've got the Kilrathi on the run.

 

[WildWeasel]

Originally posted by Ghost
I said the same yesterday in #wingnut !

And we told you why you were wrong.

 

[Ghost]

Yes, i know that !
and WE ????

 

[Bandit LOAF]

Made many, many changes to the Vega Sector and some others. List below.

My logic behind the Piper-Niffleheim chain was that it was the best way for it to make sense that the Kilrathi *could* attack Piper (since it's so far away)... and by hitting all of those systems in a row, they were attacking colonies all across the sector (since they span Enigma).

I'm not thinking of putting B'Shriss right next to Gwynedd -- but I'm going to give it to the nearest unnamed Kilrathi system... I'm loathe to add new, named Kilrathi systems when there are plenty that need titles.

Similarly, what Claw Marks are you seeing Jakarta and Anchorage in, Wedge? They're not in the original DOS version, and I don't have a SegaCD version to check here... if we can't find them, I want to use the names for a pair of unnamed systems in the Kilrah Sector.

As for Gardel and Morpheus... my take on the WC3 scene was that these were the front line, and Blair *wanted* to be assigned to the front line... where the fighting was going on. So Tolwyn points out that he's not needed -- the Kilrathi are on the run in Gardel and Morpheus. So, instead, Blair is relegated to backwater duty in Orsini.

Changes:
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Axis System renamed Axius/Axis System.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Speardon System renamed Speradon/Speardon System.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Callimachius System renamed Callimachus/Callimachius System.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Torgo System renamed Torgo/Ko'bar Yagar System.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Bistangio System renamed Bistangio/Bistango System.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Natanya System renamed Natanya/N'Tanya System.
- {Gemini Sector} Fariss Q./Clarke Q.: Eden-Rikel jump added.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Hhrass System renamed Hhrass/H'hrass System.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Unnamed System renamed K'Cris System.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u-Pak Q.: Gmar System renamed Gmar/G'mar System.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Kurasawa System renamed Kurasawa/Warach Tha System.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Venice System renamed Venice/Kharak Tar System.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./Downing Q.: Tartarus-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: K'n'Rek-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: K'n'Rek-Nephele jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q./Day Q.: Ymir-Lafayette jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-McAuliffe jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Enyo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Dieno jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Blackmane jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Blytheheart System added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint System added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint-Blythehart jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint-Lafayette jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint-Tamayo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Blytheheart-McDaniel's World jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Day Q.: McAuliffe System renamed McAuliffe/Vikyah System.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Vega System renamed Vega/Krat'na System.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q.: Aloysius System added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q.: Aloysius-Freya jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Asimov Q.: Midian System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Asimov Q.: Piper-Midian jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Talbot System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Novaya Kiev-Talbot jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Argarrio System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Argarrio-Niven jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Fiddler's Green System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Asimov Q.: Piper-Fiddler's Green jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Niffleheim System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Fiddler's Green-Niffleheim jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Ghorah Khar-Sharm jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Sharm System added.
- {Sol Sector} Terra Q./{Vega Sector} Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen/Proxima Centauri jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Chengdu System added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Downing Q.: Chengdu-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Chengdu-Hell's Kitchen jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Chengdu-Gateway jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Roberts Q.: Chengdu-Brimstone jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Roberts Q.: Chengdu-Port Hedland jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Day Q./Douglas Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Gateway jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Kurasawa-Roberts jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./{Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Tartarus-Border Zone jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q.: Tartarus-Cairo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Rostov jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Hubble's Star jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Border Zone System added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q./Antares Q.: Border Zone-Midgard jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Sharm-K'ta Mek jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q./Antares Q.: Border Zone-Tau Ceti jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Firekka-Tau Ceti jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Tau Ceti added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Tr'L Rass Q.: B'Shriss System labelled.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Rarkath System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Ghorah-Khar Rarkath jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Niffleheim System-Cabrea System jump added.

Issues List
(There are many systems and such still missing -- these are just the things that have come up so far).
- Gardel System. Figure this out, as it bothers everyone. Even people you run into on the street. "Hi!", I say. "WHERE IS THE GARDEL SYSTEM?" they yell. Yikes!
- Tal'q System -- one jump from Kilrah... OR NOT?
- Jakarta/Anchorage... Vega Sector... OR NOT?

 

[Wedge009]

These posts are getting very long...

Originally posted by Quarto
Because the timeline suggests the impossible - that Blair found Iceman while living at Caernarvon . I never liked this ("Yes, let us send a suspected traitor into a Kilrathi system in a jump-capable ship!"), but there seems to be no other way to interpret Iceman's time of death.

Clearly Iceman dies after the Tiger's Claw incident (provided the series overflow bug doesn't kill him first like it did for me the first time I played the SMs). But I can't remember where it states the time of Iceman's death. How old is Lance, because I think he said his mother receives Iceman's last medal when he was still in his nappies. Would that put it in the long decade Blair was stuck at Caernarvon?

Originally posted by Quarto
Still, placing the B'Shriss system near Gwynedd, and connecting it both to Gwynedd and Racine or K'arakh would actually solve a great problem for us - the question of where did the Concordia come from at the start of WC2. After all, had they been retreating from Ghorah Khar, we would have had to assume that the Rebellion had been crushed.

Another interesting argument - we really need to consider the logistical outcomes of where we place the new systems!

Originally posted by Quarto
They ain't there, Wedge. Actually, it's quite possible that these systems aren't even in Vega - they may be codenames for Kilrathi systems in Kilrah Sector.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Similarly, what Claw Marks are you seeing Jakarta and Anchorage in, Wedge? They're not in the original DOS version, and I don't have a SegaCD version to check here... if we can't find them, I want to use the names for a pair of unnamed systems in the Kilrah Sector.

Ehhh, I don't know where I got them from - I always thought they were from Claw Marks. I just checked TC's online version, and they're not there... so I have to ask myself "Where did I find them?" Like Rarkath, I must have included them in my list for a reason, just can't remember where at the moment. Anyway, I have the HitSquad re-release of WC1, but I'm sure the Claw Marks map is the same - the whole book is the same except for the cover.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Made many, many changes to the Vega Sector and some others. List below.

And what a mess you've made to it! I know it's hard work, but I think you may need to reorganise the arrangement of the systems. Next to Gemini, I think Vega is one of the most crowded sectors.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
I'm not thinking of putting B'Shriss right next to Gwynedd -- but I'm going to give it to the nearest unnamed Kilrathi system... I'm loathe to add new, named Kilrathi systems when there are plenty that need titles.

Still, as Quarto mentioned, it seems unusual for Blair to be going on multi-jump rescue missions, especially when at the start of WC2, he was glad just to be in a Ferret on a (what was expected to be boring) patrol.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./Downing Q.: Tartarus-Ymir jump added.

Any reason? BTW, I suggest only posting the most recent changes next time, else we'll end up with humungous posts!

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-McAuliffe jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Enyo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Dieno jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Blackmane jump added.

Why so many to Hell's Kitchen? That'd make it a major hub, and it's largely uninhabited - I don't think there's any space stations there. I know that's where you end up if you lose the Vega campaign, but the Claw doesn't necessarily go there in one jump, does she?

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Sol Sector} Terra Q./{Vega Sector} Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen/Proxima Centauri jump added.

I expect this makes sense if Confed retreats from there back to the "homeworlds", but I fear adding too many jump lines near Sol may make it more difficult from the view of defending the major jump lines from Sol to Kilrah. For now, though, it seems okay.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Chengdu System added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Downing Q.: Chengdu-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Chengdu-Hell's Kitchen jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Chengdu-Gateway jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Roberts Q.: Chengdu-Brimstone jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Roberts Q.: Chengdu-Port Hedland jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Day Q./Douglas Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Gateway jump added.

Again, this appears to be due to possible movement in WC1, but is it really necessary to make them only single route jumps? I suppose it is the simplest way out from a tactical standpoint.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Border Zone System added.

You actually named a system Border Zone?! I would have interpreted it as the Terran-Kilrathi front lines, not a system in itself.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Sharm-K'ta Mek jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Niffleheim System-Cabrea System jump added.

Yay, glad you approved.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Tau Ceti added.

Is it necessarily Confed? Placement would appear to make it a Border World - many systems which were Confed during the war are now part of the UBW.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Epsilon Sector} Tr'L Rass Q.: B'Shriss System labelled.

Interesting placement. Is it possible to argue that Iceman died before the Tiger's Claw was destroyed on her attack run in K'tithrak Mang?

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Rarkath System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Ghorah-Khar Rarkath jump added.

Do you think it would make sense for Rarkath to have another jump line elsewhere? ("Ghorah Khar-Rarkath border")

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- Gardel System. Figure this out, as it bothers everyone.

Ask Captain Johnny where he got Cardell from.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
- Tal'q System -- one jump from Kilrah... OR NOT?
- Jakarta/Anchorage... Vega Sector... OR NOT?

Tal'q doesn't necessarily need to be right next door to Kilrah (would the Kilrathi appreciate a Confed base so close?), just closer than the H'hrass relay station. And I want to know where I got Jakarta/Anchorage from as well.

BTW, there are so many jump lines overlaid on system with all the new systems. I can't wait until all the changes have been finalised, but just so you know - they're popping up all over the place.

 

[Mav23]

Wedge is here as always to provide us with his "constructive critiscism"

 

[Bandit LOAF]

Ehhh, I don't know where I got them from - I always thought they were from Claw Marks. I just checked TC's online version, and they're not there... so I have to ask myself "Where did I find them?" Like Rarkath, I must have included them in my list for a reason, just can't remember where at the moment. Anyway, I have the HitSquad re-release of WC1, but I'm sure the Claw Marks map is the same - the whole book is the same except for the cover.

I'll bet you got them from the SM1.5 script, posted to the CIC a while back. A check of various versions of Claw Marks reveals no evidence of Anchorage/Jakarta in Vega. I'm putting 'em in Kilrah and linking Cairo to 'em (as per SWC).

And what a mess you've made to it! I know it's hard work, but I think you may need to reorganise the arrangement of the systems. Next to Gemini, I think Vega is one of the most crowded sectors.

I've done some minor reorganizations when possible... but Vega is *very* precarious. It's got huge jumps that lead into other sectors, and would be very, very hard to move much around in.

Still, as Quarto mentioned, it seems unusual for Blair to be going on multi-jump rescue missions, especially when at the start of WC2, he was glad just to be in a Ferret on a (what was expected to be boring) patrol.

Ah, we must think outside the box -- the Kilrathi may well have deposited Iceman's corpse somewhere closer to Confed space (far, far more likely, given the fact that they do this as a terror tactic in one of the WC3 newsbriefs).

Any reason? BTW, I suggest only posting the most recent changes next time, else we'll end up with humungous posts!

Tartarus-Ymir... thinking... thinking... hmm, there was some reason for that.

Oh, right, from Pilgrim Stars.

Why so many to Hell's Kitchen? That'd make it a major hub, and it's largely uninhabited - I don't think there's any space stations there. I know that's where you end up if you lose the Vega campaign, but the Claw doesn't necessarily go there in one jump, does she?

Hell's Kitchen is a pain in the ass! My first revision added a bunch of jumps since Telep made HK the center of the "Vega Cluster" which allowed quick jumps to some of the major systems... and then various WC1 references add even more.

Again, this appears to be due to possible movement in WC1, but is it really necessary to make them only single route jumps? I suppose it is the simplest way out from a tactical standpoint.

Most of these aren't because of WC1 movement... most of them are just to add the Chengdu system into the mix. The HK-Gateway comes from the WC1 reference that a load of refugees is jumping in from Gateway...

You actually named a system Border Zone?! I would have interpreted it as the Terran-Kilrathi front lines, not a system in itself.

As would I -- I'd have been perfectly happy to call Ross 145 (or whatever) the Border Zone system from WC1... but SWC specifically calls the place the Border Zone system, and (further) jumps from there to Tartarus. Which would have been hard to do from Ross.

Yay, glad you approved.

Indeed -- sorry for not using your versions of the maps... I'd already changed stuff by the time I thought to download them.

Is it necessarily Confed? Placement would appear to make it a Border World - many systems which were Confed during the war are now part of the UBW.

Could go either way... heck, could be Kilrathi. But since the last we saw it was Confed, I guess we should leave it at that.

Do you think it would make sense for Rarkath to have another jump line elsewhere? ("Ghorah Khar-Rarkath border")

I don't think it's implied enough to stick another one there.

Ask Captain Johnny where he got Cardell from.

Will-do.

BTW, there are so many jump lines overlaid on system with all the new systems. I can't wait until all the changes have been finalised, but just so you know - they're popping up all over the place.

*Hopefully* the changes are almost final with regards to jump lines... I'm really focusing on getting Vega done so I don't have to think about it. Once I go through WC3/the WC3 novel, Vega can probably be left alone.

Some notes for me at work tomorrow (I get paid for this! Tee-hee)

Chengdu = Cheng-Du in the WC1/2 Guide.
Novaya Kiev-Gwynedd jump... from a WC2 losing ending.
Enigma-Gwynedd... WC2 losing series
Port Hedland name needs covering up.

I'm gonna stick my text versions of the WC3 book and FA on my Palm right now... and I'll *try* to remember FC so I can work on the Landreich Sector.

 

[Wedge009]

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
I'll bet you got [Jakarta/Anchorage] from the SM1.5 script, posted to the CIC a while back.

By you, none other. Of course, I shoulda thought of that. Kilrah Sector sounds good.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
I've done some minor reorganizations when possible... but Vega is *very* precarious. It's got huge jumps that lead into other sectors, and would be very, very hard to move much around in.

Perhaps it's best to clean it up when everything's done... or maybe not - you could end up with no manoeuvring room!

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Ah, we must think outside the box -- the Kilrathi may well have deposited Iceman's corpse somewhere closer to Confed space (far, far more likely, given the fact that they do this as a terror tactic in one of the WC3 newsbriefs).

I think that's probably the best explanation. They probably knew Blair was stuck at Gwynedd... but could they have done that while avoiding Caernarvon patrols?

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
My first revision added a bunch of jumps since Telep made HK the center of the "Vega Cluster" which allowed quick jumps to some of the major systems... and then various WC1 references add even more... The HK-Gateway comes from the WC1 reference that a load of refugees is jumping in from Gateway...

Ah, novel stuff... I remembered the refugee thing, it was difficult trying to sort the new changes from the old.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
As would I -- I'd have been perfectly happy to call Ross 145 (or whatever) the Border Zone system from WC1... but SWC specifically calls the place the Border Zone system, and (further) jumps from there to Tartarus. Which would have been hard to do from Ross.

SWC? That game sounds more and more weird all the time.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Indeed -- sorry for not using your versions of the maps... I'd already changed stuff by the time I thought to download them.

I expected that - which is why I'm leaving all the cosmetic fixes up to you now.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Could go either way... heck, could be Kilrathi. But since the last we saw it was Confed, I guess we should leave it at that.

I know, give it to the Firekkans!

 

[Quarto]

Hmm, I can understand your point about Cardell, LOAF, though I still disagree... but since you're going to ask Captain Johny anyway, I'll shut up .

Now, other comments. Vega Sector, Hell's Kitchen. As crowded as that system is, I think you need to add another jump line, leading directly into the Epsilon (Deneb) Sector - WC1 losing endgame.

Rarkath - I think it does need a jumpline going somewhere else... Rigakh cruisers are so rare - and are apparently principally offensive weapons, for orbital bombardment and such - that I just don't think that Rigakh could have been stationed in a system which only had one exit, into a Confed system.

B'Shriss... thinking outside of the box is fine, but I think in this case it's a bit too far outside the box. Gwynedd is a backwater, and had Kilrathi visits very rarely for a good reason - Ghorah Khar, Niven, and Enigma were all very well defended. I just don't see the Kilrathi taking the trouble to smuggle an ejection pod into Gwynedd - too far, too difficult, and too little gains compared to potential losses. Especially since we have no reason to believe they knew Blair was there. There just has to be another way .

 

[Bandit LOAF]

Now, other comments. Vega Sector, Hell's Kitchen. As crowded as that system is, I think you need to add another jump line, leading directly into the Epsilon (Deneb) Sector - WC1 losing endgame.

What Halcyon says, though, is that "The entire Confederate fleet is falling back to Proxima Centauri... to prepare for the defense of Deneb Sector."... Presumably this means that they're falling back to the Sol Sector to regroup, and will *then* move to Deneb. (Proxima Centauri is in the Sol Sector, and I added a jump to there from HK last time...).

Rarkath - I think it does need a jumpline going somewhere else... Rigakh cruisers are so rare - and are apparently principally offensive weapons, for orbital bombardment and such - that I just don't think that Rigakh could have been stationed in a system which only had one exit, into a Confed system.

Ehh, too many variables... in the case of something like Sharm, we *know* that a fleet is coming through -- but it's equally possible that the Rigakhs were produced in the Rarkath system, or that there's a raider squadron there or somesuch.

B'Shriss... thinking outside of the box is fine, but I think in this case it's a bit too far outside the box. Gwynedd is a backwater, and had Kilrathi visits very rarely for a good reason - Ghorah Khar, Niven, and Enigma were all very well defended. I just don't see the Kilrathi taking the trouble to smuggle an ejection pod into Gwynedd - too far, too difficult, and too little gains compared to potential losses. Especially since we have no reason to believe they knew Blair was there. There just has to be another way .

Although my initial idea was that they'd meet in the middle somewhere -- that Iceman's corpse would simply be dumped in the area or somesuch, it's equally possible that they went after Blair specifically... consider that...

- Thrakhath had personally sworn vengeance on Blair.
- Thrakhath *did* know that Blair was reassigned -- presumably he also knew where.
- Thrakhath had enough intel about Blair (without interrogating her) to know the importance of Angel... and hated Blair enough to concoct an elaborate scheme just to enrage him.

Anyhow -- I didn't get much done today... just some minor stuff, and some stuff from the Wing Commander 3 novel. (Actually, this is a lie -- I've done about a million and a half sketches of the Landreich Sector on my yellow pad... but you won't see any other novel stuff for a few days at least).

I sincerely hope Vega is, for the most part, *finished*. <G>

New Changes:
- {Enigma Sector} Isaac Q.: Gwynedd-Enigma jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Isaac Q./Grills Q.: Gwynedd-Novaya Kiev jump added.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Jakarta System labelled.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Anchorage System labelled.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./{Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Cairo-Anchorage jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./{Kilrah Sector} Kur'u'khag Q.: Hyperion-Kilrah jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./Douglas Q.: Blackmane-Freya jump added.

The System Pool-
New Samarkand
New Sydney
Muspelheim
Cardell

Issues List
Tal'Q Naval Base

Old Changes:
- {Enigma Sector} Asimov Q.: Midian System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Asimov Q.: Piper-Midian jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Axis System renamed Axius/Axis System.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Speardon System renamed Speradon/Speardon System.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Callimachius System renamed Callimachus/Callimachius System.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Talbot System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Novaya Kiev-Talbot jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Argarrio System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Argarrio-Niven jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Fiddler's Green System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Niffleheim System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Fiddler's Green-Niffleheim jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Rarkath System added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Ghorah-Khar Rarkath jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: Niffleheim System-Cabrea System jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q./Asimov Q.: Piper-Fiddler's Green jump added.
- {Enigma Sector} Grills Q.: {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Ghorah Khar-Sharm jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Torgo System renamed Torgo/Ko'bar Yagar System.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Sharm System added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Border Zone System added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q./Antares Q.: Border Zone-Tau Ceti jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q./Antares Q.: Border Zone-Midgard jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Bistangio System renamed Bistangio/Bistango System.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Natanya System renamed Natanya/N'Tanya System.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Sharm-K'ta Mek jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Firekka-Tau Ceti jump added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Antares Q.: Tau Ceti added.
- {Epsilon Sector} Tr'L Rass Q.: B'Shriss System labelled.
- {Gemini Sector} Fariss Q./Clarke Q.: Eden-Rikel jump added.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Hhrass System renamed Hhrass/H'hrass System.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u Caxki Q.: Unnamed System renamed K'Cris System.
- {Kilrah Sector} Kur'u-Pak Q.: Gmar System renamed Gmar/G'mar System.
- {Sol Sector} Terra Q./{Vega Sector} Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen/Proxima Centauri jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q.: Aloysius System added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q.: Aloysius-Freya jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q.: Tartarus-Cairo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./Downing Q.: Tartarus-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Roberts Q./{Epsilon Sector} Deneb Q.: Tartarus-Border Zone jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Kurasawa System renamed Kurasawa/Warach Tha System.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Venice System renamed Venice/Kharak Tar System.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: K'n'Rek-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: K'n'Rek-Nephele jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-McAuliffe jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Enyo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Dieno jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Blackmane jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Blytheheart System added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint System added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint-Blythehart jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint-Lafayette jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Midpoint-Tamayo jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Blytheheart-McDaniel's World jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q.: Kurasawa-Roberts jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Downing Q./Day Q.: Ymir-Lafayette jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Day Q.: McAuliffe System renamed McAuliffe/Vikyah System.
- {Vega Sector} Day Q./Douglas Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Gateway jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Vega System renamed Vega/Krat'na System.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Chengdu / Cheng-Du System added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q.: Chengdu-Gateway jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Downing Q.: Chengdu-Ymir jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Roberts Q.: Chengdu-Brimstone jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Roberts Q.: Chengdu-Port Hedland jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Chengdu-Hell's Kitchen jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Rostov jump added.
- {Vega Sector} Douglas Q./Day Q.: Hell's Kitchen-Hubble's Star jump added.

 

[Wedge009]

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
Ehh, too many variables...

The entire map has too many variables.

Originally posted by Bandit LOAF
I sincerely hope Vega is, for the most part, *finished*. <G>

Something new will always come up, just look at the name of the maps: <sector>_final

BTW, thanks for segregating new changes and old. Makes seeing what's new much easier. Pity my uni's computer department server is going kaput - I can use the internet, but no access to my network drive. Which makes it much harder for me to download the latest changes, allowing me to take it home and make new comments to frustrate you further.

 

[Bandit LOAF]

*fanfare*

And now... the Landreich Sector!

Now, before you ask what the hell is going on...

The Landreich Sector has some crazy requirements you have to work in... namely, three special systems.

Black Hole System 299 -- must have 12 jump points (5 unknown, 4 Kilrathi, 3 Landreich). (From Action Stations -- where Gar's Emporium was).

Jigada System -- must have 11 jump points (5 unknown, 5 Kilrathi, 1 Border Worlds). (From Action Stations -- where a Kilrathi fleet marshalled for an attack on the Landreich).

Vordan System -- must have "almost 30" jump points... which I've taken to mean, at the bear minimum, 26. One of them must be to the Landreich, and the rest to the Kilrathi.

The FRL must have 14 systems -- and the Kilrathi must have "more than twice that".

There has to be a very, very long jump from "Orleans" to "Orestes" (WC4 novel). This is, apparently, the current longest jump on the map.

(Enigma and Epsilon sectors are updated with some Landreich related stuff... I'll figure out where Paghk is in Kilrathi space and label that soon.)

 

[Wedge009]

Well done, LOAF. Although I don't have the novel(s) relevant to the Landreich, I'm sure others will appreciate what you've done and the hard work put into it. (A million and a half sketches!)

A couple of other things:

Epsilon Sector
B'Shriss or B'shriss? I know WCP's subtitles are full of errors, but it does say B'shriss.

Kilrah Sector
I know your policy about using unnamed systems, but is it really wise to put Anchorage only one jump away from Kilrah? Especially when you expect so many more systems to come from End Run? Also, they're not very Kilrathi sounding names. Like the systems in SM1, Anchorage and Jakarta could just be codenames which now (in 2681) have Kilrathi names known and recognised. If Confed could get that close to Kilrah, wouldn't it push on? I don't think we were doing that well at that point during the war.

BTW, what's the blank sector for? And the Landreich Sector is rimward from Enigma Sector, on the same plane? Thanks for putting in a jump from Rarkath. Actually, that could make more sense, considering we never see Rigakh cruisers in the rest of Enigma, they're probably from the Landreich area... unless you know better.

[Just curious, was the Orleans-Orestes jump made in one go?]

 

[Bandit LOAF]

The Orleans-Orestes jump required I move over two systems slightly, IIRC.

Anchorage/Jakarta should, indeed be deep in Kilrathi space -- they're the location of the secret lab where the Sivar weapon and the cloaking device were invented.

My WCP script extract is all caps, but I suppose B'Shriss is right.

blanksector is what new sectors get created from <G> It's just the template.

 

[Capn Johnny]

"Stuffed Up" ?

;-)

 

[Capn Johnny]

Sorry.. was referring to a comment Wedge009 made a page or two back..

"If Captain Johnny 'stuffed up' the names, does that mean that SO is also wrong since in one of the cutscenes it shows reinforcements coming from Callimachius?"

 

[Bob McDob]

ALL HAIL THE MIGHTY HEART OF THE JOHNNY!!!!!

 

[Mekt-Hakkikt]

Aren't we supposed not to stupify this thread?
Beside that, I fully agree with you Bob.