Drayman firepower

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We've been using the gun stats from the gun chart instead of the ones from the manual. IE, the Tachyon cannon does 3.7 damage per bolt instead of the 5.0 you see listed so often.

Turning speeds were timed like Scheherezade said.. Time taken for 10 full revolutions was measured with a stopwatch, and dps calculated from there. Actual stats from the game would be interesting, but I bet they'd be pretty close.

Engine recharge and shield drainage were worked out by hand, in a very meticulous process. Comparing AB usage, how much particular gun used with different types of shields etc etc. In practice they come out very close to the feel of the original, but again, the actual stats would be nice (though I would sure have loved them to death several months ago :D ) I wouldbe really curious about how close I came.

So, I'd be interested in those instructions :)

Add the weapons mounts from the Drayman mentioned in the 'Gemini Sector' prologue (torpedo mounts, additional turrets - if you guys want it I'll flesh it out).
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I'd love some more info on this.. A ship as large as the drayman seems like it could have a bit more armament, esp. if there is some canon justification for it.
 
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Large cargo ship does not equal gunboat.

They do need one or two turrets for protection, but you wouldn't need 8 turrets and 4 main guns if you're in a cargo ship. They don't generally go on raids of Kilrathi depots do they?
 
Luigi30 said:
Large cargo ship does not equal gunboat.

They do need one or two turrets for protection, but you wouldn't need 8 turrets and 4 main guns if you're in a cargo ship. They don't generally go on raids of Kilrathi depots do they?
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Who said anything about 8 turrets? Or 4 guns?
 
i believe that was 'imagination jumping to conclusions' :)

but seriously, nobody is planning on changing the face of privateer here.
transports are lumbering victims waiting to happen, and that is what they will remain.
remember you can kill a drayman by simply staying away from its nose and plinking it to death. when alone, they are literally effortless to kill.
might as well give it a little (seriously, a little, not a lot) help, so long as any changes we make are there in some other original WC source.
what we might do is probably along the lines of placing 1 or 2 laser turrets on the ship somewhere. also, since our AI-ship loadouts vary form ship to ship, a lot of draymans would have less than a full torret complement.

-scheherazade
 
We've been using the gun stats from the gun chart instead of the ones from the manual. IE, the Tachyon cannon does 3.7 damage per bolt instead of the 5.0 you see listed so often.
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The Gun Chart should be accurate, per Privateer's internal mechanics - the numbers come from the Privateer Playtester's Guide, which went to press after the manual. (To my shame, however, the 5.0 value should be listed too -- it comes from Privateer's Gemini Sector manual.)

--

Re: creating a continuity Drayman.

"The Frontiersman" implies that the Scarab has at least four turrets ("Hank and Johansen use the extra power to blast those freaks. Everyone else hold your fire.", p.31)

It also tells us that at least one of those turrets is a Plasma Gun ("a quick burst of plasma destroying an enemy", p.31) and that one has a {Proton} Torpedo launcher ("... Hank nailed him with a torpedo", p.31). (The story says that the torpedo fired forward, but we know that 'Hank' was in a turret).

This is the lower bounds. The crew of the Scarab was twenty, which consisted of a captain, first officer and then multiple each of turret gunners, pilots and engineers. Which means anywhere from four to fourteen turrets could be possible (the latter unlikely, of course).

In my mind all of this data, while in and of itself unspecific, suggests that the Drayman can have the same armament as its brothers in the original Wing Commander -- six turret mounts -- plus slots for two forward guns (Meson Blasters, by default).

(Of course, there's also the distinct possibility that the Scarab isn't a Drayman at all. The publish version of the manual suggests but does not state that it is - it's fulfilling the same purpose as some other Draymans, and Captain Kane is friends with their captains... but it is a unique class of ship in the unpublished manual art. That's not canon, but it bears some consideration. (Note that the manual art also suggests five turrets, all single mount. In WC1, it's five dual mount turrets and one single mount.))
 
"(Note that the manual art also suggests five turrets, all single mount. In WC1, it's five dual mount turrets and one single mount.)"

what exactly do you mean?
are you suggesting some blisters in some picture are turrets? i haven't seen any pics clearly suggesting where turrets would go.

this is what i take would be a possible drayman configuration.
2 forward mounts
5 single mount turrets
1 forward mount torpedo

also, since our privateer AI ships differ from one another, privateer-faction drayman loadouts wouldn't be set in stone for any particular instance.

-scheherazade
 
Unregistered said:
"(Note that the manual art also suggests five turrets, all single mount. In WC1, it's five dual mount turrets and one single mount.)"

what exactly do you mean?
are you suggesting some blisters in some picture are turrets? i haven't seen any pics clearly suggesting where turrets would go.

this is what i take would be a possible drayman configuration.
2 forward mounts
5 single mount turrets
1 forward mount torpedo

also, since our privateer AI ships differ from one another, privateer-faction drayman loadouts wouldn't be set in stone for any particular instance.

-scheherazade
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There's a line drawing in Claw Marks. It shows dual mount turrets in five places: over the cargo hold, over the crew compartment, under the crew compartment and on each of the (two) engine nacelles.

The sixth turret would be the single mount laser that's actually simulated in the game.

If I were putting a Drayman in "Privateer" context, I'd give it six slots for configurable turrets (five dual, one single) and two mounts for forward guns. Based on the Frontiersman article, I'd let the player stick torpedo/missile launchers in the turrets (in the tractor beam slot).

I'd also make make flying the Drayman very complex - make the initial investment really huge... force the player to pay millions for the ship, to pay salaries for a crew, to hire escorts and so forth -- but give it a giant cargo hold that will eventually make up for the investment if it's possible for the player to reach that point.
 
Bandit LOAF, your Drayman is even more powerful than my Drayman...
::o
... But I like it: "One Ship, One Purpose"
::)

A suggestion: different type of Drayman.
A Drayman for the peaceful lane ("Drayman Mk I", the Drayman standard I mean), a Drayman for the not-so-peaceful lane ("Drayman Mk II" or "Drayman ilricca custom") and a Drayman for the really dangerous lane ("Drayman Mk III", or "Drayman Bandit LOAF custom").
Maybe this is a worthy idea?
 
ilricca << the ships are configurable. so you don't really need mk1 or 2, etc.
you just load it up with more stuff. better armour, more guns, etc.

loaf <<

"The sixth turret would be the single mount laser that's [_actually_simulated_in_the_game_]."
I don't remember a turret in priv at all. it just had 2 forward gun mounts didn't it?
or are you talking about wc1's drayman? (i have the feeling you were and i just got confused)

turrets : (all equipped with 1x special slot <torpedo/missile/tractor etc>)
dual @ top centre
single @ bottom centre
dual @ top rear
dual @ bottom rear
dual @ left engine nacelle (_side_?)
dual @ right engine nacelle (_side_?)
&
standard:
single @ nose (left of centre)
single @ nose (right of centre)


would nacelle turrets be mounted below, above, or on the side of the engine nacelles?

some gameplay considerations :
side would result in gimble lock for ships attacking from the ship's side. i.e. turret would raise barrel until it's vertical, and have to turn 180 degrees around, and then lower barrel, as a ship passes the ships side. this could break the firing sequence for a moment, and it would result in awkwardly elevated barrels under typical situations.

top would give top more cover, bottom would give bottom more cover.

maybe have the nacelle turrets on the <top/bottom> if the single-mount turret spot is on that same <top/bottom> side. to sort of balance out the dificiency.

or

have the reverse, and deliberately leave part of the ship poorly defended, allowing for a specific attack tactic that abuses that weakness

-scheherazade
 
Bandit LOAF said:
(Of course, there's also the distinct possibility that the Scarab isn't a Drayman at all. The publish version of the manual suggests but does not state that it is - it's fulfilling the same purpose as some other Draymans, and Captain Kane is friends with their captains... but it is a unique class of ship in the unpublished manual art. That's not canon, but it bears some consideration. (Note that the manual art also suggests five turrets, all single mount. In WC1, it's five dual mount turrets and one single mount.))
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By an extraordinary coincidence, the Scarab in the unpublished manual art bears an uncanny resemblence to the Errant-class from the Movie.
 
well, it's only a matter of adding the turrets into the unit data, which is just a text edit, and some testing to adjust allignment.

hellcatv codes the large part of the engine, but since the features are already there, there is no need to pursuade...

mamiya0taru is pretty much the head of the privateer remake, and he seems to be willing to look into it...

so really it's just a matter of consensus on details, after which someone will make it so.


quarto << do you have a link to pics of unpublished manual art?

-scheherazade
 
Unregistered said:
quarto << do you have a link to pics of unpublished manual art?
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Sure. It's all in the CIC Archives (https://www.wcnews.com/archives/). I would higly recommend that you guys go through all the materials related to Priv, Priv Online and Priv 3 (since the idea seems to be now to have a 'classic' and an 'enhanced' version, the POL and P3 docs should give you a lot of ideas for the enhanced version), but here's the link specifically to the Priv manual art document - ftp://ftp.wcnews.com/files/documents/Priv_Manual-Art_High.zip .
 
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A suggestion: different type of Drayman.
A Drayman for the peaceful lane ("Drayman Mk I", the Drayman standard I mean), a Drayman for the not-so-peaceful lane ("Drayman Mk II" or "Drayman ilricca custom") and a Drayman for the really dangerous lane ("Drayman Mk III", or "Drayman Bandit LOAF custom").
Maybe this is a worthy idea?
Click to expand...

What I would do would be make a single Drayman that acts just like one of the 'Privateer' ships - ie, the turrets/guns/upgrades/etc. are completely optional. That way you can have the generic merchant Drayman be indentical to the merchant Drayman in Privateer -- only two Meson guns and no turrets equipped... and then you can put together specialty Draymans for individual missions (if you want to simulate a Confed military Drayman, you give it five dual laser turrets and a single laser turret and you don't equip the formward guns -- and so forth.)

I don't remember a turret in priv at all. it just had 2 forward gun mounts didn't it?
or are you talking about wc1's drayman? (i have the feeling you were and i just got confused)
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I'm talking about WC(1) -- the in-game Privateer Drayman only simulates two forward guns.

would nacelle turrets be mounted below, above, or on the side of the engine nacelles?
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I'd mount them in a manner that allows them to face forwards, as in the original Claw Marks drawing. If possible, I'd work out the turret arcs so that they simulate the same fields of fire.

By an extraordinary coincidence, the Scarab in the unpublished manual art bears an uncanny resemblence to the Errant-class from the Movie.
Click to expand...

Hehe, yeah. I'd write off the manual art as impossible to reference for this case (afterall, the guy got fired and the art wasn't used...), except it got all the *other* ships right -- Talons were Talons, Broadswords were Broadswords and so forth.

Sure. It's all in the CIC Archives (https://www.wcnews.com/archives/). I would higly recommend that you guys go through all the materials related to Priv, Priv Online and Priv 3 (since the idea seems to be now to have a 'classic' and an 'enhanced' version, the POL and P3 docs should give you a lot of ideas for the enhanced version), but here's the link specifically to the Priv manual art document - ftp://ftp.wcnews.com/files/document...al-Art_High.zip .
Click to expand...

By a great coincidence I just found out that I'm going to get a look at the Privateer 3 (last version) script tonight! Hopefully that'll be available in the archive in the coming weeks.
 
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Bandit LOAF said:
By a great coincidence I just found out that I'm going to get a look at the Privateer 3 (last version) script tonight! Hopefully that'll be available in the archive in the coming weeks.
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Then perhaps we'll have another campaign to work with ;-)
feel free to share it if you like
 
hellcatv said:
Then perhaps we'll have another campaign to work with ;-)
feel free to share it if you like
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As I predicted this morning, I got my hands on a Privateer 3 ("Privateer: Retribution") script today -- it's a really interesting Prophecy-era story about the Kilrathi kidnapping Dr. Severin to build them a weapon out of Steltek technology...
 
OOOOOO

i'm so interested, you wouldn't believe :D
do tell more :)

-scheherazade
 
OR WAIT, don't...

maybe we can seriously make a campaign of it, and actaully let people play the campaign for the first time :D

-scheherazade
 
btw, daniel, i saw you already mentioned it, i just got excited :)

<note i don't use cookies... so i don't stay logged in from page to page. it's why i don't edit last post. just a heads up>

-scheherazade
 
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