looking to buy a joystick

[cff]

Now, back on topic... I do like the heft of my Thrustmaster better than that stick (Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar), though there are several faults that people have worked around for more money. Which can be annoying since it's a $200 joystick to begin with, with $200+ mods you can have to improve it.

You CAN improve it, but that is really a topic for nerds only. The stick is very fine as it is. It not like you need to mod it because it is wrong now.
The only real bug is that one switch seems to be aligned wrong which can have it breaking. It might or mighr not be fixed in later models. I don't think my model suffers from it, but I won't open it to verify as long as it is under warranty.

OTOH, it's extremely programmable, and when it's programmed, acts like a regular USB joystick/mouse/keyboard, so there aren't any compatibility problems.

There is ONE thing you cannot do however. Have absolute mouse movement mapped to a stick axis. Relative one works fine (mouse moves faster the farther you move the stick), but absolute one (if I move the stick halfway up I want the cursor to JUMP to halfway up on the screen) doesn't work at all or very jerky (about 20 pixel resolution) with some tricks.

 

[Aron Figaro]

The Thrustmaster Afterburner 2 has the Afterburner option at the top of the throttle using default settings for Prophecy/Secret Ops, and AFAIK so does the Cougar and Afterburner 1 (but I wouldn't recommend the Afterburner 1. Detatchable throttle assembly = great improvement).

Also...for absolute mouse movement, look into third-party drivers.

 

[ZFGokuSSJ1]

I got that Saitek gaming keyboard for Christmas... It rules.

 

[Worf]

You CAN improve it, but that is really a topic for nerds only. The stick is very fine as it is. It not like you need to mod it because it is wrong now.
The only real bug is that one switch seems to be aligned wrong which can have it breaking. It might or mighr not be fixed in later models. I don't think my model suffers from it, but I won't open it to verify as long as it is under warranty.

There is ONE thing you cannot do however. Have absolute mouse movement mapped to a stick axis. Relative one works fine (mouse moves faster the farther you move the stick), but absolute one (if I move the stick halfway up I want the cursor to JUMP to halfway up on the screen) doesn't work at all or very jerky (about 20 pixel resolution) with some tricks.

For mods - yes, but some of the complaints really are legitimate when you've just dumped >$200 on a stick. The speedbrake and/or dogfight switch, for example. They are not fixed in the later ones (it's still rather random), the gimbal mechanism, and the pots (especially the throttle one - it can get destroyed by reflashing firmware(!)). Stuff that you wouldn't normally care about on a $20 stick (it breaks, buy another one), but you expect on a $200 stick.

As for the absolute positioning, unfortunately, that's not a "Mouse" function. It's a "Tablet" function. (There are 4 basic types of input devices - keyboard, mouse (relative movement), joystick (absolute positioning), and tablet (absolute positioning)). The latter two are differentiated i nthat tablets are typically 3 axis (x, y and pressure) with zero represented on the top-left corner. That, and most OS'es treat joysticks as game input devices, while tablets are associated as an absolute mouse-like device.

 

[cff]

The Thrustmaster Afterburner 2 has the Afterburner option at the top of the throttle using default settings for Prophecy/Secret Ops, and AFAIK so does the Cougar and Afterburner 1 (but I wouldn't recommend the Afterburner 1. Detatchable throttle assembly = great improvement).

Re Afterburner 1/2: Oh, thats cool. My criticism was aimed at the X series that doesn't have this. Of course all high end sticks have that option (Cougar, CH Flightstick/Pro Throttle)

Also...for absolute mouse movement, look into third-party drivers.

Like? I looked up and down and also mentioned the problem on cougarworld. All driver I found had either been relative only or did only work on the desktop, but not wirh direct input, or both.

 

[cff]

For mods - yes, but some of the complaints really are legitimate when you've just dumped >$200 on a stick. The speedbrake and/or dogfight switch, for example. They are not fixed in the later ones (it's still rather random)

Its only the speed brake one and yes, this is a very valid complaint and the one I was referring to.

, the gimbal mechanism,

?

and the pots (especially the throttle one - it can get destroyed by reflashing firmware(!)).

Its not like this would happen to everybody however. Its a very rare thing as I get it. I flashed my stick once without disconnecting (thought it was already off) and it didn't harm it.

As for the absolute positioning, unfortunately, that's not a "Mouse" function. It's a "Tablet" function. (There are 4 basic types of input devices - keyboard, mouse (relative movement), joystick (absolute positioning), and tablet (absolute positioning)). The latter two are differentiated i nthat tablets are typically 3 axis (x, y and pressure) with zero represented on the top-left corner. That, and most OS'es treat joysticks as game input devices, while tablets are associated as an absolute mouse-like device.

Well the Cougar is capable of producing absolute mouse movement, so this is an argument I don't accept. The only problem is the resolution. I can only map 50 commands to an axis (100 to ONE axis when using tricks). So it is not like the cougar could not do it at all. Its just not done right.

 

[ChrisReid]

Uh, my Ace Combat 5 stick is most definitely *NOT* the x52. I think the x52's not even released yet. It's the x45. (x52's got a very interesting LCD display...). OTOH, I would like to know where that little tidbit of information came from...

Oh wow, that's really too bad. I've handled both, and I'd personally go all out for the x52. They are released, you can buy them at CompUSA.
http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?product_code=317028&pfp=srch1

 

[ZFGokuSSJ1]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=74944&item=5153748170&rd=1 I use that to play WC.... But mine has a problem -- it's not "stuck" where it's supposed to be when you don't use it, it bends to the left, so if you leave it alone, the cursor moves to the left, and it's really quite annoying.

 

[Aron Figaro]

Hey, I used to use one of those back in my old Descent days! Go Gravis! Anyway...the one thing about Thrustmaster controllers is that they're highly programmable. If you can't find a driver that does what you need...write one, or get somebody you know to write one. Personally though, I'll just stick with having Thrustmapper give me burners on the top end and instant stop on the bottom end of my throttle. Next project - disabling or repairing the twist on my Logitech Wingman Extreme so I can set it up as a backup stick, or a two-stick system for something.

 

[Worf]

Oh wow, that's really too bad. I've handled both, and I'd personally go all out for the x52. They are released, you can buy them at CompUSA.
http://www.compusa.com/products/product_info.asp?product_code=317028&pfp=srch1

Ah. Didn't know that. Oh well.

As for the Cougar complaints...

Gimbals - they wear out quite quickly, being machined out of aluminum and being fairly weak. Plus moving the stick off axis is somewhat unnatural (for those who don't know what I mean - the Cougar stick, while being very nice, wants you to move it in the X or Y directions. Move it off those axis and you'll notice it. It feels almost like a detent when you cross the axis). Hence a large number of mods meant to counter this effect (honestly, it's the only stick I've used that had it).

But the pots are another sticky issue - while the switches are nice, the pots are crap that do tend to wear out/spike quite readily. It's a very wierd problem I've usually attributed to Cougar owners really getting their value out of the stick, but, it's there. (And yes, another fix is a set of hall-effect sensors, or to get replacement pots).

Like I said, the Cougar is a very nice stick. I love mine (though I don't use it as much anymore), but it takes a really dedicated person to really want to invest $200 on it over anything else. (Though, I suppose it's good that it's $200 *now*. It used to be $400+!)