Whazzzzzup

[Vondoom]

Well there are mainly two major space-sims that started everything in a big way. They play nothing alike and one is far more realistic while the other is more action oriented. I, of course, am speaking of Wing Commander and the X-Wing series. Wing Commander focused the story on the individual and on fast action paced gameplay that payed little attention to realism of any kind. X-Wing favored much more realistic gameplay at the cost of slower battles and more complex mission objectives (sometimes annoyingly so). Until Independace War, almost every space sim fell into one of these two groups. It is also why the Freespace games are the only ones that have gotten good reviews across the board except for the Big Two. And that was because it borrowed or lifted or however you want to put it the best things of both X-Wing and WC games and even added a bit of its own to the mix. To say it is a WC rip-off is impossible since it has many many more features than any single WC game has ever had. Same way to say it is a X-Wing rip-off. It ripped off both (if you can say taking a good feature of a game is ripping it off). Second yes, the first FS MP wasn't great until patched but after patched was quite playable. And FS2 was even better. I think they should have delayed Prophecy to put in MP if it was going to be at all feasable. I and almost anyone I know would have gladly waited for MP to be added. Diakantana's massive development was destroyed by virtually everyone on the development team leaving. The game should have been canned. I think the biggest problem is that EA wants to be safe and the space sim market is in a slump right now and they are afraid of the waters. Although I am still surprised that they stopped working on an online only WC/Privateer game. There is Alligence already and with Freelancer coming out next year, EA will be hurting if it releases any kind of WC online product after other people have already established online games out there that are simular to it.

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There is no God but myself. No destiny but what I deem for me. I walk my path and no others, for I am free.

http://www.ntr.net/~vondoom

 

[Bandit LOAF]

It is very easy to sit around after a game has come out and say "Oh, we'd definately have waited for it to have more features" -- anyone who has actually endured a delayed Wing Commander game knows better. The thrashign Origin recieved from their fans over their two month delay of Wing Commander IV is certainly still fresh in *their* minds.

 

[Vondoom]

I'd wait any day for any game that comes out better because they waited to make it better, more stable, or have added features. This goes for any WC or non-WC game. I'm tired of games that need hundreds of patches (Luckily WC has never had a problem with that) and games that promise something, then rush it out for the christmas market. Should have Blizzard waited so long to release Diablo2? Of course and 2 million people agree with it. Should Ultima: Ascension have been released when it was? No, the game is obviously unfinished. I'll always wait for a game is finished. My life isn't so empty that I can do nothing but bitch and moan because they developers are actually trying to make the game work properly and is balanced. Anyone who does otherwise needs to get a hobby.

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There is no God but myself. No destiny but what I deem for me. I walk my path and no others, for I am free.

http://www.ntr.net/~vondoom

 

[Bandit LOAF]

And the very minute the entire gaming industry relies only on the one sale they make to you, Vondoom, the world will be a far better place.

 

[Vondoom]

Yeah, and I'm sure thatevery person who bought Ultima Ascension, Ultima Online, and Diakantana were pleased with the products they got. I know I just love games that crash regularly and are not stable. Give me more programs like that. Everyone else must love the bugs. And people that buy crappy or unfinished games are never unhappy. No, not at all.

------------------
There is no God but myself. No destiny but what I deem for me. I walk my path and no others, for I am free.

http://www.ntr.net/~vondoom

 

[Bandit LOAF]

My God, you're daft. Nobody said people *like* buggy games -- I said that people *don't* like waiting for games. Two different things.

 

[Vondoom]

Actually they can have alot to do with each other. We get buggy games when games are rushed out to meet a deadline or a season, you might get the game you've been wanting and not have to wait, but it will probably be deficient as most computer games are nowadays. Diablo 2 was delayed. If it had been forced out no one would have been happy with it, as it would have been severley unbalanced and probably not stable to boot.

------------------
There is no God but myself. No destiny but what I deem for me. I walk my path and no others, for I am free.
http://www.ntr.net/~vondoom

[This message has been edited by Vondoom (edited October 10, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by Vondoom (edited October 10, 2000).]

 

[Bandit LOAF]

I am fully aware that the reason games are buggy is because they are rushed to release. I am also aware that this has absolutely nothing to do with what we were talking about. People do not sit quiety when games are delayed. Period. I'm not saying it's *right*, I'm just saying it *is*.

 

[Earthworm]

LOAF, did you get the email I sent to news@wcnews? The one about the polish WC article?

Ah, but when they saw what they were waiting for, all was forgiven

.

It was? I was under the impression that many people were dissapointed with it's graphics back then, and now it's released half a year later with the same engine which looks even worse now, when you compare it to BG2. BTW, did you get Diablo 2 yet? The polish version of the game is quite well dubbed too.

I'm firmly in favour of companies taking as long as they need on new games, if only to reduce the number of patches (which, indeed, have no right to exist).

Oh, me to, at least some times. But there are also games that I've been waiting for an extremly long time that came out way to late, and still buggy.

Ah, but WCP still looks nice, even now

.

But what if it didn't? Many people these days, unfortunetly seem to be more focused towards eyecandy than story or great gameplay. If Prophecy came out few months after some new game with an engine that looks 10 times better and similar gameplay, it could have been quickly forgoten, and wouldn't sell anywhere near the 700K units it sold.

And I fail to see why MP wouldn't work. At the least, they could have created a LAN mode. Worked in Armada...

True, but that's not what most people want. They want to have a little dogfight with their friends across the planet, or a little cooperative gameplay. And I'm just speaking from personaly experience of the FS multiplayer. This isn't an attempt at a vs thread, just a fact that MP in FS was and is bad. Even after patches, Vondoom.

I'd rather not look at it

.

That's OK, you don't have to suffer through that.

I wouldn't know...

There must be someone in Australia that playes FS besides you.

Try to find them.

Still, my point was just that I find it very irritating when people label every single space-sim out there a WC ripoff. There were other space-sims out there, before WC.

Oh, very true. WC may have been the most revolutionary of them all, but it wasn't first. I've seen some reviews that call Privateer an Elite ripp off. Of course for me there's not similarity between the two other than the trading aspect.




[This message has been edited by Earthworm (edited October 10, 2000).]

 

[Quarto]

It was? I was under the impression that many people were dissapointed with it's graphics back then, and now it's released half a year later with the same engine which looks even worse now, when you compare it to BG2. BTW, did you get Diablo 2 yet? The polish version of the game is quite well dubbed too.

Well dubbed? That's a first

. I didn't get it yet, because - even though I think it's a great game - it's not really my type of game. I might change my mind once the price goes down a bit, though

.
And yes, many people are disappointed with the somewhat-aged graphics in the game engine, but it doesn't seem to matter that much... I certainly haven't heard any complaints about the gameplay - or the game sales

. Besides, the cutscenes were still head and shoulders above the competition.

Oh, me to, at least some times. But there are also games that I've been waiting for an extremly long time that came out way to late, and still buggy.

Companies which make such games should be dismantled, and their employees should commit Zu'kara.

But what if it didn't? Many people these days, unfortunetly seem to be more focused towards eyecandy than story or great gameplay. If Prophecy came out few months after some new game with an engine that looks 10 times better and similar gameplay, it could have been quickly forgoten, and wouldn't sell anywhere near the 700K units it sold.

I don't think so. All things considered, WC4's game engine wasn't much better than WC3, and yet it sold.

There must be someone in Australia that playes FS besides you.

Try to find them.

Heh... I've been here for more than eight months now, and I still haven't even tried to connect to Battle.Net for a game of StarCraft

. Multiplayer - unless it be on a LAN, with people I know - isn't too high on my things-to-do list.

Oh, very true. WC may have been the most revolutionary of them all, but it wasn't first. I've seen some reviews that call Privateer an Elite ripp off. Of course for me there's not similarity between the two other than the trading aspect.

Elite was the inspiration for Priv - but Priv put its own WC-esque spin on things, hence the lack of similarity.

 

[Earthworm]

Well dubbed? That's a first

.

It is actually.

Some of the lines are read a bit slow though, and some of the weapon or demon names sound really freaky in Polish.

I didn't get it yet, because - even though I think it's a great game - it's not really my type of game. I might change my mind once the price goes down a bit, though

.

Hey, it's from Blizzard. You know you'll like it.

And yes, many people are disappointed with the somewhat-aged graphics in the game engine, but it doesn't seem to matter that much... I certainly haven't heard any complaints about the gameplay - or the game sales

.

Very true. Not only do the graphics look prety good IMO, the gameplay is great. Mush improved over D1 IMO.

Besides, the cutscenes were still head and shoulders above the competition.

Again, true. Though a little more of them, and a little more story would be nice.

Companies which make such games should be dismantled, and their employees should commit Zu'kara.

Aren't we a little harsh?

They might have a good excuse.

I don't think so. All things considered, WC4's game engine wasn't much better than WC3, and yet it sold.

But it had the news of incredibly high budget to propell it a bit, and not much competition at the time.

Heh... I've been here for more than eight months now, and I still haven't even tried to connect to Battle.Net for a game of StarCraft

. Multiplayer - unless it be on a LAN, with people I know - isn't too high on my things-to-do list.

Yet you would play WC online?

Elite was the inspiration for Priv - but Priv put its own WC-esque spin on things, hence the lack of similarity.

Exactly. Games like FS, or SL borrow heavily from the WC series (maybe they even are inspired by them), but all things considered the only real simularity is the fact that they take place in space. After a certain amount of time it's very hard to think of something revolutionary to put in the game, and that's one of the things that's killing off the space sim genre IMO. The rescent space sims are basicly what we had 10 years ago with WC1, plus MP, improved grephics, and pretty cutscenes.

 

[Quarto]

Some of the lines are read a bit slow though, and some of the weapon or demon names sound really freaky in Polish.

I can imagine...

**Hey, it's from Blizzard. You know you'll like it.

** - Well, you got a point there...

**Again, true. Though a little more of them, and a little more story would be nice.** - Yeah, one can always use more cutscenes.

**Aren't we a little harsh?

They might have a good excuse.** - ...Like?

**Yet you would play WC online?

** - Honestly? I don't know. Probably, yes - just because it is WC.

Exactly. Games like FS, or SL borrow heavily from the WC series (maybe they even are inspired by them), but all things considered the only real simularity is the fact that they take place in space. After a certain amount of time it's very hard to think of something revolutionary to put in the game, and that's one of the things that's killing off the space sim genre IMO. The rescent space sims are basicly what we had 10 years ago with WC1, plus MP, improved grephics, and pretty cutscenes.

Must be a cold day in hell, because we're completely in agreement

.

 

[Vondoom]

Yeah, the last original space sim was Independence War due to its realism with real space physics. Other games had done it before but never well.

------------------
There is no God but myself. No destiny but what I deem for me. I walk my path and no others, for I am free.

http://www.ntr.net/~vondoom

 

[Earthworm]

**Aren't we a little harsh?

They might have a good excuse.** - ...Like?

They didn't know what the hell they were doing.

Romero most likelly didn't, wasn't Daikatana his first real game?

 

[Unknown_Pilot]

[

But you can't argue, it's MP was simply put bad.

I wouldn't know...

Still, my point was just that I find it very irritating when people label every single space-sim out there a WC ripoff. There were other space-sims out there, before WC.[/B]

well when 4 pc mags all agreed it was a ripoff, i decided to try the game for myself.
i had to agree it was it was like a cross between several flight sim games i already had

 

[Quarto]

well when 4 pc mags all agreed it was a ripoff, i decided to try the game for myself. i had to agree it was it was like a cross between several flight sim games i already had

All hail the mighty game mags which never blunder!
But yes, you can agree with them - after all, you are entitled to your opinion.

They didn't know what the hell they were doing.

Romero most likelly didn't, wasn't Daikatana his first real game?

Well, it was the first project he was leading, I think - but certainly, his experience with id Software should have given him an idea of how to make games

.