Whatever happend to....

AKUMA1

Spaceman
Just continuing to check out the playthroughs of Wing Commander 1: Secret Missions, what I want to know is whatever happend to Halycon the head of operations on the Tiger Claw did he die?(the man who gives the mission briefings) Never saw any mention of him in Wing Commander 3 or 4? Can't remember if he was in Wing Commander 2? So what happend?:confused:
 
I believe he was on board the 'Claw when she was destroyed at K'tithrak Mang, and hence he did die prior to WC2. However, I could be wrong on this... Anyone want to confirm that for me?
 
If you play the "losing win" endgame of WC2 (where you screw up that the final battle is not in K'Tithrak Mang, but back in Gwynedd near Caernaven Station), when you shoot down Jazz the conversation is slightly different. The first is from the winning path in K'Tithrak Mang, and the second is from Gwynedd:

K'Mang:
Wing Commander II said:
Maverick: Nailed you, bastard! Good night, Colson…


Jazz: No! NO! Please don’t kill me. PLEASE!


Maverick: Mercy went out the door with my career ten years ago.


Jazz: You need me to prove your innocence. I can…


Maverick: Not an option, Jazz.

Gwynedd:
Wing Commander II said:
Maverick: Nailed you, bastard! That’s it for you, Colson…


Jazz: Don’t kill me, Maverick!


Maverick: Why not?


Jazz: The flight recorder disk is in my quarters! It’ll prove that you weren’t responsible for the destruction of the Tiger’s Claw! But you’ll never get it without my help, my computer’ll erase it! You need me, Maverick!


Maverick: I’ll just have to risk that, Jazz.


Jazz: No! I can give you the names of the Mandarin leaders! Their Kilrathi contacts! ANYTHING!


Maverick: How many deaths are you responsible for, Colson? Specialist McGuffin, General Halcyon, Iceman, Knight, Hunter, everyone else on the Tiger’s Claw… And Mariko… And you think I’ll let you live, bastard? No, I don’t think so…


Angel: Don’t kill him, Maverick!


Maverick: How many people has he murdered, Angel? He deserves to die!


Angel: Non. He deserves justice. We will take Jazz back to the Concordia. He will stand trial at Confed High Command. You have done well, mon amour! You must report to the Admiral immediately.


Since SO1 assumes that you won the 'winning' endgame and destroyed K'Mang, we never see reference of General Halcyon's death in the official storyline. Doomsday does make a quote about survivors in the initial mission series in Gwynedd, right when you arrive on the Concordia:

Wing Commander II said:
Doomsday: So, here we are… survivors of the Tiger’s Claw. I’m surprised there are so many of us left. Now all we need is Paladin and Maniac so we can all die together.

Since the Claw survivors that were on Concordia at the time were Blair, Jazz, Angel, Spirit and Doomsday, we can infer that anyone not mentioned (including Halcyon) died. However, this quote (and the dialogue from the losing endgame) directly conflicts with the events of Fleet Action, which show that Hunter survived up until right before the Battle of Terra.

Long story short - most evidence points to Halcyon dying when the Tiger's Claw is destroyed.

I hope this helped!
 
Since the Claw survivors that were on Concordia at the time were Blair, Jazz, Angel, Spirit and Doomsday, we can infer that anyone not mentioned (including Halcyon) died. However, this quote (and the dialogue from the losing endgame) directly conflicts with the events of Fleet Action, which show that Hunter survived up until right before the Battle of Terra.

It could be argued not to directly contradict it inasmuch as Doomsday may be just listing the survivors of the attack on K'Tithrak Mang, whereas Hunter didn't fly in that assault, having transferred off, well, he says "the day previously" but given they were obviously in Kilrathi space at that point and this is Hunter we're talking about there may be a degree of exaggeration there.

EDIT: I have to say, though, I've always considered blaming the loss of the Claw on Jazz to be a bit daft. Even assuming he gave its position away to the Kilrathi before the attack was launched I don't think that changes the battle much. The Claw would inevitably have been detected anyway - it might have gotten closer, possibly close enough to launch a heavy strike at the starbase - but with no way of preventing the assault from the prototype Strakha it's unlikely to survive.

Blair is as much to blame as anyone for the loss - his not reporting the stealth fighters to the Claw - even as "Tiger's Claw, I'm suffering a radar malfunction here..." would have caused fighters to be pulled back to defend the carrier, which would have at least given it a fighting chance.
 
This is a bit of a stretch. We can't say the Tiger's Claw would necessarily have been destroyed without Colson's intervention, stealth fighters or not. The Concordia ultimately made the very same trip and survived.

Additionally, placing blame for the destruction of the Tiger's Claw on Blair also seems inappropriate to me. So he was the first to encounter the stealth fighters, but he clearly was not able to transmit that information to the Tiger's Claw before it was destroyed anyway. And when he did have the chance to report that information when being rescued by the Austin along with the others, who believed him?
 
Since SO1 assumes that you won the 'winning' endgame and destroyed K'Mang, we never see reference of General Halcyon's death in the official storyline. Doomsday does make a quote about survivors in the initial mission series in Gwynedd, right when you arrive on the Concordia:

Since the Claw survivors that were on Concordia at the time were Blair, Jazz, Angel, Spirit and Doomsday, we can infer that anyone not mentioned (including Halcyon) died. However, this quote (and the dialogue from the losing endgame) directly conflicts with the events of Fleet Action, which show that Hunter survived up until right before the Battle of Terra.

I believe the WC1/2 Ultima Strategy Guide puts Halcyon aboard the Claw when it was destroyed, but in general we should be careful about drawing too much from the comment that just those few around the table survived from the Tiger's Claw, because other people we might assumed to have died may not have been serving on the Claw when it was destroyed. Voices of War from Armada makes a reference to something "Shotglass gave me after K'tithrak Mang."
 
So all in all Halycon died on the Tiger Claw attack...well that sorts out one confusion at least!...~~~
 
I believe the WC1/2 Ultima Strategy Guide puts Halcyon aboard the Claw when it was destroyed, but in general we should be careful about drawing too much from the comment that just those few around the table survived from the Tiger's Claw, because other people we might assumed to have died may not have been serving on the Claw when it was destroyed. Voices of War from Armada makes a reference to something "Shotglass gave me after K'tithrak Mang."

I'm going to have to look through the ultimate strategy guide again, but I seem to recall it talking about when the claw was destroyed "Shotglass, Halcyon, they're all gone."

Not an exact quote, I'll have to reread.
 
I'm going to have to look through the ultimate strategy guide again, but I seem to recall it talking about when the claw was destroyed "Shotglass, Halcyon, they're all gone."

Not an exact quote, I'll have to reread.

USG page 161 said:
Colonel Halcyon, Lefty, Shotglass, and more than 750 others were dead.

That's the exact quote.
 
I'm probably asking a dumb question, but how is the pronunciation of the name "Halcyon"? (i'm not an english native speaker).

And i was always curious about what happened to him, but i always assumed he went down with the Tiger's Claw.
 
I personally see little reason as to why Halcyon would have been anywhere else when the Claw was destroyed. To say that he might have been flying at the time is a HUGE stretch. It's like saying Blair was born a poor black child.
 
Since the Claw survivors that were on Concordia at the time were Blair, Jazz, Angel, Spirit and Doomsday, we can infer that anyone not mentioned (including Halcyon) died. However, this quote (and the dialogue from the losing endgame) directly conflicts with the events of Fleet Action, which show that Hunter survived up until right before the Battle of Terra.

Fleet Action actually addresses this directly (it would have been an issue when the book was written)--there's a scene at Tolwyn's manor on Earth where Hunter and Vanderman (another Tiger's Claw pilot) are each surprised that the other is still alive.

I believe the WC1/2 Ultima Strategy Guide puts Halcyon aboard the Claw when it was destroyed, but in general we should be careful about drawing too much from the comment that just those few around the table survived from the Tiger's Claw, because other people we might assumed to have died may not have been serving on the Claw when it was destroyed. Voices of War from Armada makes a reference to something "Shotglass gave me after K'tithrak Mang."

Yes... we need to consider perspective in a lot of this, which is what the Fleet Action conversation is trying to remind us of. In most cases we're dealing with first-person sources--Blair's memory, LaFong's book, etc--rather than straight histories of the war... so it's possible that some characters believe Shotglass is dead while another knows he isn't.

Maverick: How many deaths are you responsible for, Colson? Specialist McGuffin, General Halcyon, Iceman, Knight, Hunter, everyone else on the Tiger’s Claw… And Mariko… And you think I’ll let you live, bastard? No, I don’t think so…

A lot of people cite the note from Hunter in the 'Wing Commander II' section of Blair's Kilrathi Saga yearbook as proof that he should know Hunter is alive--but although it's filed (scrapbooked?) after letters referencing the loss of the 'Claw and Blair's disgrace, it seems to have been written earlier (towards the end of Freedom Flight--he's asking for advice about what to do with Kirha).

The true oddity is now Iceman, who is given a seemingly Jazz-free post-Tiger's Claw death in Wing Commander Prophecy... and one that involved Blair recovering his body, to boot.

I personally see little reason as to why Halcyon would have been anywhere else when the Claw was destroyed. To say that he might have been flying at the time is a HUGE stretch.

At the end of Secret Missions 2 (some four months before the 'Claw is destroyed), he says he is transferring to Tactical Command and that he has nominated Blair to replace him as squadron commander. That's why the Wing Commander I & II Ultimate Strategy Guide has to specifically explain that he *hasn't* transferred yet (... before killing him).
 
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