Quit Jerking Up the Voting Thread

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LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
klauss said:
Meh...I'm not complaining.

Starting at your "LOAF... you're making a big mistake" and working my way down through your earlier posts in this thread, it seems like thats *all* you did.

klauss said:
Right now, IMO, this poll has no meaning.

Apparent ballot stuffing proves otherwises.

klauss said:
Both because of the stuffing (if it did happen - I won't be certain until I see the results, I guess), and because of the filtering.

I don't see why someone fixing a poll so that it's fair to everyone is such a bad thing.

klauss said:
The stuffing is obviously a spoiler, but the filtering can easily go wrong, and spoil the poll just the same.

Blame the gangrene, not the surgeon who must remove the leg. LOAF wouldn't have to "filter" anything if there wasn't (a) jerk/s who wanted to win an internet poll so badly.

klauss said:
So, I just don't care what happens... I'm just trying to warn LOAF about the dangers of performing that kind of filtering.

Well, I'm so glad you're here to tell us these things!
 

Master Wooky

Spaceman
This forum really sucks!

@ LOAF:

You seem to be a smart guy but you'd better be dictator in a small banana republic than being forum administrator.

You threaten people
you tell them what's right and what's wrong
you insult people
you dare to tell people what to do in other forums

you really shouldn't have this job!!!

@ most of cruis members:

you seem to think it's your job is to give every newbie a hard time
you discuss every stupid word. honestly one better doesn't join your forum witout a lawyer!
you stupid selfunderstanding as the one and only WC fan community really sucks. If you feel so elite, just close the forum for newbies, so that the worthy gene pool doesn't become diluted... ~~~

Everytime I'm here I promise myself never to come back again, yet, for some strange reason I always come back.
But hey, I got a solution for this problem:

LOAF, you bloody jerk, ban me or delete my account. whatever you like better...;)
 

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
So, I just don't care what happens... I'm just trying to warn LOAF about the dangers of performing that kind of filtering.

Gee, thanks, but has there ever been a single situation where I haven't been much smarter than you?

You're not some sage wziard, you're part of a group of idiots who can't even moderate their own message board. You're actually the guy starving to death because he's been spending days trying to put the hot dog in his mouth sideways. If there's a bright center to the concept of properly moderating something using common sense and careful planning, cuckolded Vega Strike sleazebags are the point furthest from it.

Oh dear, I'll be disregarding the possibility that somehow twelve different people had the same IP instead of just one over a half hour period yesterday. What a terrible, terrible shame. What are the chances of that beyond the situational aspect, anyway? 4,228,250,625 to the 12th power to 1?

Get over yourselves and stop cheating.
 

klauss

Spaceman
LeHah said:
Blame the gangrene, not the surgeon who must remove the leg. LOAF wouldn't have to "filter" anything if there wasn't (a) jerk/s who wanted to win an internet poll so badly.
That's true.

LeHah said:
Well, I'm so glad you're here to tell us these things!
Bandit LOAF said:
Gee, thanks...
You're welcome.

@loaf: You really ought to speak with more respect towards others.
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
Come out and admit to ballot stuffing?

I don't know. Its something you have to prove to someone over time. Its not like theres a form you fill out.

I'll say this much - so far, you've done nothing to endear yourself to him.
 

klauss

Spaceman
And you keep suggesting I voted twice.
I didn't.

I just can't do anything to endear myself to him because he attacks every post.
I don't know what will get to him in a friendly manner... it seems like everything I say he sees as either wrong, inappropriate or stupid.

I know a lot of people, and they don't think that way of me, so I guess it's specific to LOAF-me communication rather than a general issue.
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
klauss said:
I just can't do anything to endear myself to him because he attacks every post. I don't know what will get to him in a friendly manner... it seems like everything I say he sees as either wrong, inappropriate or stupid.

Lesson to be learned - stop posting things that are wrong, inappropriate or stupid.
 

klauss

Spaceman
:lawl:

Joking... right? Or do you really think every post of mine is like that?

(I suspect the real problem is my signature)
 

Maj.Striker

Swabbie
Banned
Just to clarify my previous post. The CIC is not a democracy, just because I may want something to be someway doesn't mean it will be. How the poll is handled and the allowing (or disallowing) of newly registered members to vote in the poll is entirely up to the forum administrators.
 

Sarty

Rear Admiral
Staying out of LOAF's sights is as simple as making posts that are somewhat intelligent. Many people have problems with this, which is why many people have problems with LOAF.

On topic, I voted for Standoff and Saga's new website. Now if you can count that is one vote for each poll. Was that so hard?!
 

klauss

Spaceman
LOAF: Just a suggestion.

Make a ruleset to avoid this kind of situation (stuffing), and publish and enforce it next year. Avoid being in a place where you have to delete votes... that's not good.
 

Bandit LOAF

Long Live the Confederation!
This forum really sucks!

@ LOAF:

You seem to be a smart guy but you'd better be dictator in a small banana republic than being forum administrator.

You threaten people
you tell them what's right and what's wrong
you insult people
you dare to tell people what to do in other forums

you really shouldn't have this job!!!

Hehe, adorable -- are you trying to get on the Vega Strike Wall of Heroes?

First, on the whole dictator thing -- on one hand, it's very, very tempting to point out the horrible problem with the analogy. That problem is that it's a completely silly thing to say that is so often repeated in this grand internet as to have become our foremost cliche. It's also entirely disrespectful, not to me but to anyone whose lives are actually somehow effected by a dictator. I'm sure you read about the concept in 5th Grade World History class and are still rubbing your back soar from pointing out how clever you are to take something that's bad in *real* life and apply it to the internet... but there's people all over the world who have to deal with actual dictators. To compare something as trivial and unimportant and nonbinding as running a message board to actual cases of terrible men murdering and killing and looting the resources of their countries is a farce when properly considered.

On the other hand, there's some truth to it.

The Chat Zone is not a democracy. I'll point that out with my dying grasp. Anyone who thinks it could or should be is an idiot. I'll spare the tired internet argument about how a republic is not a democracy either, but ultimately yes, a functional chat zone has more in common with a 'dictatorship' than it does a 'democracy'.

Lets face it, I've been elected President for Life in exactly the same way as might be a dictator. As you said, I am a smart guy, but that's probably not why I have this job. Here's the ready and easy way to your own CIC: seventy bucks for a board license, ten bucks for web hosting and some basic English ability.

So, what makes this board succesful when things like WCDC or WingCenter or WCRevival or LancersReactor with the same physical elements fall apart?

Well, again, some of the elements of a dictator -- charisma, for one. Who can doubt that I have a zany, overblown internet personality that a lot of people love and some people hate? Dedication to an ideal, too. We have a singular vision for The Way Life Should Be... and we work towards that goal rather than some elected choice. Certainly, we roll with the community... but there's various things that a "free" society might elect -- advertisements, hosting pirated games, reporting on other space sims, etc.

(On the other hand, these ideals apply just as well to the idealized head of a republic. One needs charisma nd a strong platform to be elected... so the only real difference in terms of punching each other in silly internet debates is which equally specious argument one wants to apply the same set of facts to. I don't care, personally: as the aphorism goes, you know you're doing something right online when someone calls you Hitler.)

Now, let me tell you why we fight.

Ask yourself: exactly what could vindicate this terrible thread for me? Is there anything to gain by making sport of Hellcat's cheating? Yes, there is. Last night we had non-regulars showing up in IRC throughout the night, ostensibly to shoot the shit about how dumb the Vega Strike folks are being. This single, unifying point lead to a night of talking to new people about things like editing False Colors, where the Concordia goes in the timeline, how to treat Pegasus versus Alexandria as a Pearl Harbor analogue, Action Stations as Antietam, how to create 'space weather' to make future space sims more interesting... all kinds of insanely interesting *Wing Commander* things. And the catalyst that allowed for that is that 'patriotic' feeling that they're part of the Wing Commander community and the Wing Commander community has been forced into conflict with a lesser entity that seeks to betray it. Yes, it sucks for all of Vega Strike that MKruer and company decided to bring you into this... but our choice was to either let it happen or use it as an opportunity to make our group better -- and that's a non-choice.

@ most of cruis members:

you seem to think it's your job is to give every newbie a hard time
you discuss every stupid word. honestly one better doesn't join your forum witout a lawyer!
you stupid selfunderstanding as the one and only WC fan community really sucks. If you feel so elite, just close the forum for newbies, so that the worthy gene pool doesn't become diluted... ~~~

We respect intelligence -- but we also respect spirit. Who could argue that ZFGokuSSJ or McGruff are especially bright?

The fact that I feel bad about pointing out stresses my point... being a *good* person is enough for us, we require no particular level of intelligence. Being officious, mean spirited, devoted to some crazy external ideal beyond all measure... these things will come back and hurt you here.

(Similarly, you must have a very low self esteem to complain with a straight face that you feel excluded because everyone else is smarter than you are. Buck up, pal.)

On to Klauss:

How would I go earning LOAF's respect, then?

This is a good question.

The easiest way is to be part of the community.

I have a weakness for anyone who takes the time to visit #WingNut, really, and I'll admit that here.

Beyond that, if you're someone I see partaking in everyday discussions rather than just fighting over his particular fan project then you'll certainly build respect with me. Is Quarto great because he made Standoff? No -- he's great because he participates intelligently in everyday Wing Commnader discussions. If he was just the "Standoff guy" who posted here to let us know how great Standoff was, who could love him or feel him part of the community?

Moreover, though, don't insult my intelligence. When we get six people using the same computer in rapid succession to vote for Vega Strike, immediately following a request at the Vega Strike forum requesting that people come do that, we know what's going on. There's no chance that what happened yesterday was an accident. None at all.

And you keep suggesting I voted twice.

You did not. Hellcat and others the group you are defending did.

LOAF: Just a suggestion.

Make a ruleset to avoid this kind of situation (stuffing), and publish and enforce it next year. Avoid being in a place where you have to delete votes... that's not good.

There's no problem with deleting votes when they're clearly fraudulently made. If we just magically killed them without explaining ourselves, sure -- but we've been very clear to post what's going to happen.

And once again, this comes down to our community being smarter than others... we don't *need* a rule (though one may be on the books from previous years) saying that you can only vote once. The poll went fine save for one external group.
 

Dyret

Super Carrot!
LOAF has already given you a much more well written reply, but I'll post this anyway...

Master Wooky said:
This forum really sucks!

What would you know about that... I havent seen a single one of your post which isnt somehow related to those two horrible, horrible vegastrike projects. You have no idea what the real community is like.

If you don't like, leave it.

you seem to think it's your job is to give every newbie a hard time
you discuss every stupid word. honestly one better doesn't join your forum witout a lawyer!

You know, people were actually quite nice to me, when i was a newbie, even though I acted like a moron at times. You know why... Because I actually cared about Wing Commander, and even if, as certain people has pointed out before, most of the stuff I posted was stupid, it was nothing compared to your crap.
"Hey, look! We Just found a new way to fuck up the Wing Commander universe... What you dont like it, Origin would have put 62 turrets and a PTC on the Drayman if they had the technology back then. FUCK YOU ALL!" You don't care about Wing Commander at large, you only come here troll about your own half ass mod.

LOAF, you bloody jerk, ban me or delete my account. whatever you like better...;)

I hope he does.
 

Halman

PSY-YI-YI
God dangit, shut the hell up about telling the moderators here how to run their forums. You can't go "Lawl, even though we had our backwards little group of jerks cheat, it's unfair of you to make sure the voting is fair"(And no, I'm not accusing YOU of voting more than once, but it is happening). The way that real people deal with voting fraud is to ignore fraudulent votes.

GASP

SHOCK

In our case, that means deleting them.
 

GreyViper

Rear Admiral
Have to say my vote goes for Privateer Gemini Gold. Maybe its because the game would have more replay value or the free roaming mode suits me more then linear campain in most other games. Matter of taste IMHO. :D
 

LeHah

212 Squadron - "The Old Man's Eyes And Ears"
I'm selling a swift kick to the ass for a dollar. Many people in this thread need what I'm selling. (People will buy what they want, not what they need)
 

Nomad Terror

Rear Admiral
It should be made clear that there isn't a Gemini Gold vs Standoff fued going on here. Anyone who is treating this like a fued needs to really reassess their priorities.

I highly respect those who voted for Gemini Gold because they honestly feel that it is, in their opinion, superior (be it by a margin or a long shot) to the other projects nominated. I likewise highly respect those who voted for any of the other nominees for the same reason.

Heroes are not made here by "opposing the system" or bending the rules, but rather by standing for personal integrity and making an effort to work with the community, not trying to force the community to work with you.

I know my opinion means jack to most people here, but I see the CIC staff bending over backwards trying to give the community much more power over the voting process this year. Then I see some people taking advantage of that for their own personal self-martyring agenda. This is not fair to the CIC staff or the community.
 

Eder

Mr. Standoff
This thread is stupid, and this years voting has been ruined. I'd ask the CIC to remove Standoff from the voting, but I (as opposed to a couple dozen random internet jerks that weren't around *last week*, let alone in 1990) am intelligent enough to understand that the CIC can't do that. Thanks are due to all of you idiots for completely removing my motivation to work so hard on a fan project.
 
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