It is indeed against the law in this country to burn our flag ( unless done by an honorgaurd in the proper ceramony) fly ANY OTHER flag Higher than our own, and many others.
to be somewhat egoticious. Furthermore, while the US is "bringing freedoms to coutries that need'em" the government is chipping away at our own freedoms subtly. I find this a little weird, don't you? I'm saying this not in hopes of sparking a flame war, but rather to provide a more moderate perspective and maybe learn something myself.
To me it just appears some idiot tied it to the flagpole upside down...the picture is a testament to the stupidity of the gentleman who created it. (Or at least that's my invented backstory to it...having an imagination is fun).
As for the debate over the first amendment, I support the right to freedom of speech and the right to make controversial statements, however what's "good for the goose is good for the gander" so if someone wants to make a statement by burning a flag, etc no one better complain when others make "politically incorrect" statements about the person who burned the flag etc.
LOAF, I agree with what you're saying however, I think my problem (which I left for the most part unstated in my prior comments) has more to do with the frequency and extent of the current administration's deceptions.
Bandit LOAF said:Eh, again, you're just stuck in the middle of the ordinary political process. Each side yelling that the other is lying about something isn't anything unique. In terms of the larger debate, the things you're told to think about have almost nothing to do with whatever moral issue has been used to motivate you. All the arguing about the President pursuing a war in Iraq and wiretapping Americans and so forth isn't because the Democrats have some problem with war or because they feel there's been some terrible infringement of human rights -- it's because he hasn't involved congress. The balancing of power between the executive and the legislature under the constitution is the classic debate in American politics, and nearly everything here is part of that same knife-fight that's been going on for two hundred years.
Every administration ever is going to spend much of its time lying... I mean, that's the classic joke about campaign promises right there. From Lincoln insisting he won't interfere with slavery to FDR promising not to involve the country in World War 2, the president's job is not to tell us the truth (and there's plenty of negative ones, too, which somewhat compete with the idea that there's anything unique going on today -- from Reagan lying about supplying weapons to rebels to all that nonsense about Clinton).
In fact, I would go so far as to argue that much of the angry e-teen i-rhetoric about the current president has more to do with righteous indignation over the fact that he *doesn't* lie in the manner we've become accustomed to -- he's happy to insist he has the war power and can do whatever he wants, and is completely unapologetic about things people don't like.
Wait... so we shouldn't complain about stuff that isn't good because it's been that way for a long time?
Bandit LOAF said:Well, if I had to address the masses I would say that we need to have a better grasp of the entire situation before we complain. Simply parroting one side's uneven rhetoric isn't nearly as smart as we've all decided it must be. Everyone who's running around screaming that this is the end of the world because Bush lied about the headline du jour needs to understand that they're being told to think that way for a reason other than they assume. If, with that understood and the I'm-raging-against-the-machine! element taken away, then I think continuing such an argument is completely noble.
I'm certainly all for the right to complain (that was, after all, implicity in my comments on the flag...) -- but I think it's sad that we have college students raging about impeaching the president when the actual argument they're being used as pawns towards is about constitutional issues that they don't know about or understand.
Keep in mind some of my examples in the post you're replying to, though - are we worse off for the fact that Lincoln freed the slaves and that FDR was trying to figure out how to enter the war with Germany? The blanked idea that "THEY LIED!" means something is wrong is a terribly unrealistic, simplified way to look at things - it is very frequently absolutely necessary to distort the truth in order to pursue some other goal, and this is something we've tacitly acknowledged as part of the executive's job for as long as the country has been around.
Maj.Striker said:Well said, if you haven't already, you could certainly expand this post into an excellent college paper...
Cargoman said:Very few things can cause a more heated and irrational debate than
showing the flag discourtisey .
Both sides of such a disscusion will be emotional , rarely rational .
It's a good way to get attention , and cause a lot a shouting and anger .