Specifications/Histories

Aeronautico

Rear Admiral
I've updated/written a number of articles on the WCPedia, but they are very incomplete because of a lack of ship statistics and general histories. These are the ships in question:

Durango-Class Heavy Destroyer/Carrier
Caernaven-Class Frigate
Bearcat
"Dragon/Lance" (What became of them?)

I got almost zilch with stats on the first two, and the Bearcat I'm guessing doesn't have a very well-established backstory (I know this has been brought up before, so please, don't criticize me). If anyone has anything they can offer, any sources, let me know and I'll update these articles.
 
If I recall correctly, in the WC4 novel, the Durango was an old Confed destroyer passed onto the Border Worlds where it went through a refit to a carrier but still retained its weaponry such as torpedo tubes (not present in the game though). The Bearcat was never widely adopted due to engine problems, but I believe that was mentioned in fan fiction and not canon. As for the Caernaven and the Dragon, I've got nothing. Woulda been nice had the powerplant from the Dragon been carried over into Prophecy and Secret Ops.
 
The Bearcat was never widely adopted due to engine problems, but I believe that was mentioned in fan fiction and not canon. As for the Caernaven and the Dragon, I've got nothing.

The dragon probably went the same way as the Wraith. Superships have a tendancy to be expensive and not realistic to mass produce. Or they disappeared into Black ops as an exclusive ship.
 
More than likely, they were destroyed after the Black Ops project was suspended. Happens in modern military all the time. Or as R Lee Ermey would say "It went the way of the dodo" hehe.
 
TPoF remarks that the Durango is an old Confed design that had a flight deck added on. Nothing really beyond that.

Bearcat probably has least amount of information on it than any ship. You only get what you get from WC4...

Lance's are only mentioned in WC4, TPoF and S*S but there is no concise history of what became of them.

Your best bet is simply have the articles represent what we know. No need to fill in blanks that you have no way of doing.
 
The Bearcat was never widely adopted due to engine problems, but I believe that was mentioned in fan fiction and not canon. As for the Caernaven and the Dragon, I've got nothing. Woulda been nice had the powerplant from the Dragon been carried over into Prophecy and Secret Ops.

The dragon probably went the same way as the Wraith. Superships have a tendancy to be expensive and not realistic to mass produce. Or they disappeared into Black ops as an exclusive ship.

We have to be careful about this kind of stuff and the wikipedia. Statements like "X Ship probably went the same way as my foggy recollection of Y Ship" are scary. We see the Wraith very successfully mass produced in Wing Commander Armada. Quote and summarize what you see/hear/taste in the books/games/movie/etc and you can't go wrong. Just because we hear about the Wraith very little doesn't mean that it didn't go on to be a plentiful front line super star. Information we know about the performance of the Reaper Cannon, which was newly implemented on the Wraith, suggests that the ship saw widespread use.
 
Yeah, what Chris said.

One thing that's very, very important to remember about contributing to the WCPedia is simply the fact that you must accept gaps in our knowledge. I would even suggest that these gaps should be highlighted - entries should include comments like "this ship only appeared in game X, and thus there is virtually no information about it". This kind of information would be hugely helpful for fan projects - and who knows, maybe one day for new WC projects as well? It would be great to be able to identify at a glance what ships/places/events were underused in the WC universe and deserve to be explored more closely.
 
Yeah, what Chris said.

One thing that's very, very important to remember about contributing to the WCPedia is simply the fact that you must accept gaps in our knowledge. I would even suggest that these gaps should be highlighted - entries should include comments like "this ship only appeared in game X, and thus there is virtually no information about it". This kind of information would be hugely helpful for fan projects - and who knows, maybe one day for new WC projects as well? It would be great to be able to identify at a glance what ships/places/events were underused in the WC universe and deserve to be explored more closely.

This is one of the things I've posted to the WCPedia discussion pages. As much as one might want to fill in blanks, it's best to just report the facts as we find them in the sources.
 
Yup... price is certainly a reason, but its not the only one (though the fact that production cost of one Dragon was probably like 10X to 50X that of an Excalibur).

Reason 1 - Cost Efficiency

The Dragon, with its nuclear engine, ramscoops (eternally self-refueling so no limit to afterburners or need to dock/refuel for jumps), cloak, and gun loadout (charging fission cannon or whatever that special charge-gun was) probably made it like so expensive that you could make a dozen excaliburs in comparison.

Which is why, as they put it in the WC Saga fan-game, they put noobies into Arrows (or whatever light or cheap medium fighter they have). The Kats realized the same thing... no matter how well trained you are, on your first real combat mission there's like a 50% chance you're not coming back. (your chance gets far better with each mission due to experience, so unless their desperate for pilots, its skill PLUS experience = better ship.)

Which is why the Kats tend to have lots and lots and lots of cheaper ships. MOTIVATION TO SURVIVE.

Reason 2 - Possible Pilot Killer?

Blair and the Black Lightning's super-soldiers were teh only ones to really pilot the Dragons too... so quite possibly the ship was "too good" for most normal humans to pilot.

Nearest comparison of what I mean can be seen in Getter Robo - Neo vs Shin. In essense the ship could be a pilot-killer... the thing is so fast and maneuverable that even with the high-tech flight-suit and life-support gear, that the ship's g-capacity (in turns and acceleration/deceleration) would injure if not kill most pilots. (anyone who's seen teh first ep of that anime has seen how even an excellent pilot can crasn'n'burn if subjected to enough G)

Most of the Lance were genetically engineered super-soldiers... and as such, were enhanced with superior strength and tissue resiliance (though muscle has little to do with it. It has more to do with cell density, tissue elasticity, etc. )

Good example is Seether's fav maneuver. That drop'a'mine and ride'its'shockwave type maneuver could easily cause internal bruising if not capilery ruptures and/or organ damage in older pilots or gifted-but-physically/biologically-weaker pilots. God-like pilot skills won't save you if the moment you're in a 4G turn half your internal organs decide to break loose and dance around.

You through something like this (reason 2) in with reason 1 and you end up with a good way to loose a war extremely quickly. (half your pilots die due to lack of experience, and most of the other half die cause they couldn't survive the first high-G maneuver they try.) Its why they stick you in a simulator long before they let you into the real thing.

POSSIBLE EXCEPTIONS

There's a limit to what inertial dampeners and simple spring-based or sponge-based shock absorbers can do (short of the wonderful magical super-high-teck ones in Star Trek).

In a few sci-fi's I've seen them have the pilot submerged into some kind of thick viscous fluid, often with a breathing tube or some breathable fluid (like amniotic fluid... the liquid stuff babies "breathe" while inside their mothers) cause the thick fluid acts like one giant shock absorber. Problem is that this method is expensive and difficult to do... which is why you often seen robotic drones (no human pilot or remote piloted) or bugs (grown ship/pilot combinations) or variations of the two (non-physical telepathically operated controls, thought-reading controls, etc... ).
 
Yup... price is certainly a reason, but its not the only one (though the fact that production cost of one Dragon was probably like 10X to 50X that of an Excalibur).

The Dragon, with its nuclear engine, ramscoops (eternally self-refueling so no limit to afterburners or need to dock/refuel for jumps), cloak, and gun loadout (charging fission cannon or whatever that special charge-gun was) probably made it like so expensive that you could make a dozen excaliburs in comparison.

The Excalibur had the same matter/anti-matter powerplant as the Dragon/Lance. It was the testbed for the system. This isn't simulated in the game (the novel details it), but all ships have some sort of ramscoops for extended flight. The Excalibur also mounted a cloak and a big rack of super guns. I don't necessarily doubt that the Lance cost more to produce, but I don't see a whole lot backing up the idea that it was multiple times more expensive.

Most of the Lance were genetically engineered super-soldiers... and as such, were enhanced with superior strength and tissue resiliance (though muscle has little to do with it. It has more to do with cell density, tissue elasticity, etc. )

Good example is Seether's fav maneuver. That drop'a'mine and ride'its'shockwave type maneuver could easily cause internal bruising if not capilery ruptures and/or organ damage in older pilots or gifted-but-physically/biologically-weaker pilots. God-like pilot skills won't save you if the moment you're in a 4G turn half your internal organs decide to break loose and dance around.

I would be very careful with this type of speculation and discussions concerning the wikipedia.
 
Nearest comparison of what I mean can be seen in Getter Robo - Neo vs Shin. In essense the ship could be a pilot-killer... the thing is so fast and maneuverable that even with the high-tech flight-suit and life-support gear, that the ship's g-capacity (in turns and acceleration/deceleration) would injure if not kill most pilots. (anyone who's seen teh first ep of that anime has seen how even an excellent pilot can crasn'n'burn if subjected to enough G)

Wing Commander's plot devices and game mechanics are not to be intermingled with those of unrelated fiction. That's how we get things going around that has to be frequently debunked. Point: acceleration dampeners.
 
I agree with you, but what was the issue with acceleration dampeners? Acceleration absorbers are a component called out in the WC1 blueprints and they are a system that can take damage in WC1.
 
I wasn't very clear. The argument of g-forces and physical stamina being factors in the Dragon is dubious since we have things such as acceleration dampeners. While I don't recall anything specific said on them anywhere, the name implies that it allows the vessel and its pilot to endure g-forces they normally can't.

EDIT: Acceleration absorbers. And the 'pedia states clearly that's what they did.
 
Back
Top